D&D (2024) How should a Summoner/Pet Class be implemented in 1DnD?

CreamCloud0

One day, I hope to actually play DnD.
It’s only locked if that is the only way to get them.

A lot of folks want a lot more of thier focus to be on the pet than can be done with a feat.
plus locking an entire archetype-playstyle behind a feat chain/set means you can't be taking ASI or using other feats to actually customise your character outside of making them do the fundamental thing you want them to do in the first place, imagine if the only way to play a spellcaster was with a class who had no innate magical abilities you just had to aquire everything magical you could do through feats.
 

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doctorbadwolf

Heretic of The Seventh Circle
plus locking an entire archetype-playstyle behind a feat chain/set means you can't be taking ASI or using other feats to actually customise your character outside of making them do the fundamental thing you want them to do in the first place, imagine if the only way to play a spellcaster was with a class who had no innate magical abilities you just had to aquire everything magical you could do through feats.
Absolutely.

Now, having both is rad. Imagine if you could take follow up feats to magic initiate and gain another 1st level spell and a 2nd level spell. Have another that requires level 8 that gives one each of 1st, 2nd, and 3rd.

Or even, maybe, the second feat gives a whole Spellcasting progression, so a pure martial becomes a 1/3 caster, a 1/3 caster is close to a 1/2 caster, and a half caster is like a 2/3 caster, if you take the whole feat chain.

Probably no way to get a 8th or 9th level spell outside an epic boon feat.

Anyway, point is it’s dope when you can focus on something in your class and with other options.
 

Clint_L

Hero
I'm of the mind that summoner/pet classes don't belong in the game. While it fits the fiction, it breaks at the table. It slows down play, overly empowers the group with augmentation of targets/actions/hit points/etc.
What is absolutely essential for it to function is that those powers MUST come from somewhere. The summoner MUST spend actions to grant her summoned creatures actions. This is to balance the game experience. Also, the HP of the creatures should come from the summoner's HP pool.
The only other way to balance it would be an extremely short duration, which would essentially be only flavor for a spell. "A lion materializes, rushes the opponent you designate, makes an attack, and immediately disappears."
I'm offended the instant anyone casts a summoning spell. Like "hey let me now contend with 15 wolves on your turn. Thanks a lot for adding 45 minutes to this encounter."
No player should have this level of power over the game experience.
It's also not going to be a OneD&D thing. Setting that aside, the only way I see it working without making combat even more tedious is by using monsters that are summoned singularly, and you can only have one at a time, or with a group template (like a swarm), not as a bunch of individuals.

Basically like a ranger's pet or artificer's automaton, but with more variety.
 

CleverNickName

Limit Break Dancing
Absolutely.

Now, having both is rad.
Heh. I was about to post this:
1683904136295.png


I'm not suggesting we make any changes to the classes and subclasses, I'm suggesting that we add a handful of feats. And those feats could be stand-alone, or they could be chained together like in Diablo II, either one would be fine with me. Or for the really minor stuff we could handle it with a Background feature.

Like, suppose there is a feat that gives you the Animal Handling proficiency and the druid's 2nd level "Spirit Totem" feature, and a second feat would improve that feature to 6th level. A Circle of the Shepherd druid obviously wouldn't be interested in it, since it won't really do anything new for them. A fighter might be, however, if they wanted to summon spirit animals and the only alternative was to multiclass.
 
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doctorbadwolf

Heretic of The Seventh Circle
Heh. I was about to post this:
View attachment 284809

I'm not suggesting we make any changes to the classes and subclasses, I'm suggesting that we add a handful of feats. And those feats could be stand-alone, or they could be chained together like in Diablo II, either one would be fine with me. Or for the really minor stuff we could handle it with a Background feature.

Like, suppose there is a feat that gives you the Animal Handling proficiency and the druid's 2nd level "Spirit Totem" feature, and second feat would improve that feature to 6th level. A Circle of the Shepherd druid obviously wouldn't be interested in it, since it won't really do anything new for them. A fighter might be, however, if they wanted to summon spirit animals and the only alternative was to multiclass.
I’d just make it a magical pet that isn’t as limited as the Druid’s pet. After all, there are two feats that let you learn find familiar. I’d also rather the shepherd Druid be interested in it at least a little, because imo stuff like this should offer both the option to gain new abilities and the ability to improve on what you already have.

But I like the general idea.
 

Vael

Legend
We can have multiple ways to ... skin this metaphorical cat. A summoner base class shouldn't invalidate a Beastmaster Ranger, Shepard Druid or Astral Construct Psion (fingers crossed).

In many ways, this is almost why I'd say a full Summoner class needs to lean away from the Primal power source, just to better thematically differentiate itself.
 

doctorbadwolf

Heretic of The Seventh Circle
We can have multiple ways to ... skin this metaphorical cat. A summoner base class shouldn't invalidate a Beastmaster Ranger, Shepard Druid or Astral Construct Psion (fingers crossed).

In many ways, this is almost why I'd say a full Summoner class needs to lean away from the Primal power source, just to better thematically differentiate itself.
In general I think a summoner is best suited to the arcane power source. Monstrosities, undead, fey, fiends, I guess aberrations since I can't convince yall to excise them from the game.
 

ChameleonX

Explorer
A quick example of one possible route:

Summoner
Hit Points

HP at 1st Level.
6 + Con score
HP/level. 1d6 (4) + Con mod
Hit Dice. 1d6 per level


Proficiencies
Armor. None
Weapons. Simple Weapons, Net, Whip
Skills (choose 3). Animal Handling, Arcana, Acrobatics, Deception, History, Insight, Intimidation, Medicine, Nature, Persuasion, Religion, Survival, Sleight of Hand

Summon Servant (1st-Level)
As an action, you summon a creature from another plane of existence and bind it to your service. The Servant appears in an unoccupied space you can see within 60ft of you. The Servant is friendly to you and your companions, and obeys your commands. You determine it's appearance and mannerisms (which has no effect on it's stat block), and choose its creature type; Aberration, Beast, Celestial, Dragon, Elemental, Fey, Fiend, Giant, or Undead.

A servant shares your initiative in combat, but always acts at the end of your turn. It can move and use reactions on it's own, but the only action it will take on it's turn is Dodge, unless you use a bonus action to command it to take a different action. This can be an action in it's stat block, or some other action. If you are Incapacitated or otherwise unable to command it, the servant acts independently to defend you and itself from harm.

A servant vanishes when reduced to 0 hit points, or if you dismiss it as a bonus action. Each time the servant vanishes, it regains all it's hit points and all effects on it end. When you summon a servant, you can summon the same one, or a different one, but you can have only one servant at a time.

Pact Magic (1st Level)
The magic of your bond allows you to cast certain spells while you have a servant summoned. You can't cast spells if your servant is not on the same plane and within 1 mile of you.

You know two cantrips of your choice from the Arcane, Divine, or Primal spell list. You learn a new Cantrip at 4th level, and again at 10th level. All of your cantrips except the first one must be Conjuration, Divination, or Necromancy spells.

Each time you finish a long rest, you choose a number of spells from the Arcane, Divine, or Primal spell list equal to half your level (round up) + your Intelligence, Wisdom, or Charisma modifier (your choice).


Each spell must be of a level equal or lower than your spell slots, and must be a Conjuration, Divination, or Necromancy spell.

You have two 1st-level spell slots, which you regain when you finish a long rest. You can also spend one minute in meditation to recover your spell slots. You can do this twice, and must then finish a long rest to do so again.

At 3rd, 5th, 7th, and 9th level, all of your spell slots increase in level. You gain one additional spell slot at 5th, 7th, 13th, and 17th level (to a maximum of six 5th-level spell slots).

When you cast a spell, you can choose to use your servant's space as the origin, but you must determine line of sight using your own senses.

Summoner's Bond (2nd Level)
You gain one of the following benefits of your choice:

Blood Bond. You and your servant gain proficiency with Light armor, Shields, and with a number of martial weapons of your choice equal to your spellcasting modifier. You can use your Spellcasting ability instead of strength or dexterity for attack and damage rolls with any of the chosen weapons.

Spirit Bond. You gain proficiency with one skill or tool of your choice. Then, choose two of your skill or tool proficiencies. You gain Expertise with both of them.

Mana Bond. Once per turn, when you deal damage with a spell, you can add your Spellcasting ability modifier to the damage roll against one of the spell's targets.

Coordinated Strike (5th-Level)
Your servant can attack twice, instead of once, when you command it to take the Attack action. If you used the Help action on your turn to grant advantage to your servant, it has advantage on both of these attacks.
 



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I wonder if the subclasses should be for different type of monsters: plant, undead, construct, elemental, fey, dragon, aberration..
 

Horwath

Legend
IMHO,
just make it a feat available to all.

Animal companion:
+1 ASI

gain medium size animal companion
STR 15, DEX 15, CON 15, INT 6, WIS 12, CHA 8
HP: 5 + 5×your level
AC: 12+prof bonus
Attack bite: d20+ 2×prof bonus, damage 1d6+prof bonus
Skill proficiencies: Athletics, Acrobatics, Stealth, Perception. Pick one expertise from those 4.
Saves: proficient in all
Evasion feature.

movement type:
1. Speed 40, Climb 40
2. Speed 30, Swim 30, can breathe underwater
3. Speed 20, Burrow 20
4. Speed 20, Fly 40, damage reduced to d4, has flyby attack.

you need to spend a Bonus action to command your companion, or one attack from your Attack action.


Large companion feat:
requires animal companion.
+1 ASI

you companion becomes large.
add +10 ft to all speeds
STR and CON becomes 19.
HP is 10+6 per level
AC is 13+prof bonus.
Damage is 1d8(1d6 flying) and companion attacks twice with Attack action.
Companions attacks count as magical.
 
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