D&D 5E How should the Sorcerer look when he (or she) comes back?

Steely_Dan

First Post
I have never seen or felt a need for a sorcerer class (just a synonym for wizard), and certainly not that Dragonborn Fighter/Wizard aberration in that playtest packet.

...what the hell was that?

But if there is to be a Sorcerer, the bloodline thing could be a cool way to go, but I do not want them wearing platemail due to certain relatives.
 

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Nellisir

Hero
three different ways to cast magic and all the classes being able use these different casting ways I'm fine with that. but there should be three different classes though. each one gains their different ways. Wizards gain them from years of study. Sorcerers gain them from a power in the bloodline. Warlocks gain them from making a deal with a ancient power. these three shouldn't be combined into one class. They should feel different from each other. Each class should feel different from itself also. You should be able to put two wizards next to each other, two sorcerers next to eachother and two warlock next to each other, and they should all feel different, depending on where they learned their magic or their tradition (the wizard), their bloodline (sorcerer), or the pact that they make (warlocks)

You're talking about two different things here. How a character gains power, that's a role-playing issue. That's all fluff. Maybe my wizard learned his spells from the ghost of a red dragon, and has to sacrifice some food every morning to regain spells. Maybe they're brought every morning by imps from the elemental plane. Maybe they were tattooed on his skin by an evil slavemaster, and he spends his life trying to understand what's written on him. Maybe his "spellbook" is his hair, braided with knots and little stones that dictate each spell.

Different concepts, same mechanics, same class.

I think what you want are clearly different mechanics, but those mechanics ought to be disentangled from the fluff, and they should be clear and different. This "like better weapon proficiencies, combat capability and hit points than the wizard" just sounds like a fighter/wizard, and this "a spontanoeus caster needs at least double the number of slots/spellpoints/mana and more mundane abilites (hit points, proficiencies an even attack bonuses)" just sounds broken. You don't mention anything about restrictions, just "spontaneous caster", so presumably he gets all spells a wizard does, per day, and doubled(!), unlimited known spells, more hit points, better weapons, etc etc.

IMC, I rebuilt the sorcerer as a hybrid/gish class. Spontaneous casting, but very limited spell selection, martial weapons, etc, etc. I also use occult (pact/bargaining) magic as a third type, alongside arcane and divine (and psionic, actually. Innate magic probably constitutes a fifth type). Shamans, witches, and cultists all use occult magic.
 

Grimmjow

First Post
You're talking about two different things here. How a character gains power, that's a role-playing issue. That's all fluff. Maybe my wizard learned his spells from the ghost of a red dragon, and has to sacrifice some food every morning to regain spells. Maybe they're brought every morning by imps from the elemental plane. Maybe they were tattooed on his skin by an evil slavemaster, and he spends his life trying to understand what's written on him. Maybe his "spellbook" is his hair, braided with knots and little stones that dictate each spell.

Different concepts, same mechanics, same class.

I think what you want are clearly different mechanics, but those mechanics ought to be disentangled from the fluff, and they should be clear and different. This "like better weapon proficiencies, combat capability and hit points than the wizard" just sounds like a fighter/wizard, and this "a spontanoeus caster needs at least double the number of slots/spellpoints/mana and more mundane abilites (hit points, proficiencies an even attack bonuses)" just sounds broken. You don't mention anything about restrictions, just "spontaneous caster", so presumably he gets all spells a wizard does, per day, and doubled(!), unlimited known spells, more hit points, better weapons, etc etc.

IMC, I rebuilt the sorcerer as a hybrid/gish class. Spontaneous casting, but very limited spell selection, martial weapons, etc, etc. I also use occult (pact/bargaining) magic as a third type, alongside arcane and divine (and psionic, actually. Innate magic probably constitutes a fifth type). Shamans, witches, and cultists all use occult magic.

Shouldn't fluff and mechanics go hand-in-hand?

If you start with the fluff: a sorcerer gains arcane magic because of a power creature who helped sire his bloodline. In this case a dragon. Now you have to use mechanics to show both his arcane power and the powers from the dragon that sired his family.

If you start with mechanics: You have a class that can use arcane magic and a few dragon like powers. Now you have to explain both the arcane magic and the dragon powers.

I have never seen or felt a need for a sorcerer class (just a synonym for wizard), and certainly not that Dragonborn Fighter/Wizard aberration in that playtest packet.

...what the hell was that?

But if there is to be a Sorcerer, the bloodline thing could be a cool way to go, but I do not want them wearing platemail due to certain relatives.

Ya the first shot at the sorcerer was way to much. Dragon sorcs should have claws and scales but the way they did it was WAY to much. Again: WAY to much. but what other kinds of bloodlines do you think would be fun?

I've decided to add a shadow bloodline to my list. Somthing from the shadowfel.
 
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Drowdruid

First Post
Re: Shadow Heritage

That should be Vampiric Heritage or Spectral Heritage which IMO should you transform into transparent and ethereal ghost at higher levels.
 

Grimmjow

First Post
That should be Vampiric Heritage or Spectral Heritage which IMO should you transform into transparent and ethereal ghost at higher levels.

those are more undead than shadow. When i think shadow i think living creatures in the shadowfel. But i agree they should be able to to turn into a shadow creature at higher levels.


When i thought about undead sorcerers i wanted them to be gruesome. At some point they should become immune to poison and disease. why? well how else are they suppose to be able to eat rotten and raw meat?
 

Drowdruid

First Post
Most of the creatures of Shadowfell is undead, and especially powerful ones that could inheritate their soul in blood of the descendants. Dragons are powerful too;)
 

Grimmjow

First Post
Most of the creatures of Shadowfell is undead, and especially powerful ones that could inheritate their soul in blood of the descendants. Dragons are powerful too;)

this is true there are a lot of undead there but living creatures exist too. Maybe sorcerers shouldn't have a bloodline dedicated to these creatures but they do need to show up at some point. Shadar-kai welcome!
 

Drowdruid

First Post
Re: Shadar-Kai as source of heritage

I don't think most playable races are strong enough to be source for sorcerous heritage. They are not iconically powerful but rather mundane. I think there should not be dwarven heritage or elven heritage, although it could be fey heritage with bloodline from archfey or maybe also from unicorns?:-S
 

Steely_Dan

First Post
The more I think about it, I'm not sure about the bloodline thing, it was only vaguely mentioned (draconic) in the 3rd Ed PHB, right? I would prefer it to be a wild mage type or something, or folded into wizard (non-Vancian).
 

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