I Have 8 20th Level Characters -- Now What?

[Drowbane]

Retirement

"Back in my day..."

Retire the PCs. Start a new campaign. In any free time, come up with some low-epic adventures, about 6 months down the road when you have alot of material to try out, bring the old fogeys out of retirement in a big way. Something that requires thier specialized abilities!

At first your Players might be bummed, but hitting 20 used to be the end. Now just let it be a break from the high lvl action to give you time to think. If you've run them from 1 to 20 you should have no trouble challenging new characters. Keep the campaign world going with minor events. Perhaps the new party is already lvl 6? (personally I hate starting any lower than 4... bleh)

You players will be thrilled when sometime down the road you bring thier Heroes back into the action.

In short, mix it up.

 

[Aluvial]

"Back in my day..."

Retire the PCs. Start a new campaign. In any free time, come up with some low-epic adventures, about 6 months down the road when you have alot of material to try out, bring the old fogeys out of retirement in a big way. Something that requires thier specialized abilities!

At first your Players might be bummed, but hitting 20 used to be the end. Now just let it be a break from the high lvl action to give you time to think. If you've run them from 1 to 20 you should have no trouble challenging new characters. Keep the campaign world going with minor events. Perhaps the new party is already lvl 6? (personally I hate starting any lower than 4... bleh)

You players will be thrilled when sometime down the road you bring thier Heroes back into the action.

In short, mix it up.

This isn't a bad idea either. Right now, I feel as if I'm going to have to tie up some loose ends. The group played through the module RttToEE and most survived, there are a few characters that joined up near the end of that, so I feel that Tharizdun will have to be included again to bring it full circle. Also, we are adventuring near and in the Vesve. They are going to tackle the Defiled Glade in the SE portion of that great wood.

Other elements of importance will include Iuz, (perhaps The Fugus Lady Zuggtomoy), and a few other little things here and there. I have a Pychic Warrior, and I want to pay his character off is some way; there has been very little psionic activity (he wanted a Flayer!), perhaps I'll give him some.

The Great Wyrm Red Dragon I had made a threat to Highfolk (another adventure destroyed that city, from Dungeon, it was a tall tree with a Druid at the top, can't remember the name?), and the party slayed him (the dragon). I also made that dragon a mount for Iuz's lead general, whoever that is. Revenge could come into play.

My feeling is that I need a suitable challenge for my group at the end of the adventure to help tie up loose ends. The thing should be big. My mind drifted towards the Tarrasque, but that is a little cliche.

Anyhow, once I develop this adventure, I will allow the characters (who live) to maintain realms that there new characters will play in. I'm using a modified Fields of Blood system to work the realms, and politics will be a minor role in the overall scheme of things.

What do you guys think? Any other thoughts on the type of challenge? I will definitely look at that Dungeon adventure.

Aluvial

 

[I'm A Banana]

Seriously, your group sounds like the reason the Epic Level rules as they exist now were *created*. They want to keep doing the same things they've been doing since 1st level.

The good thing about epic levels, if you're already used to high-level powers, is that they aren't particularly complex. The amount of random buffs and bumps the PC's get is slow, steady, and predictable. Power after 20th level comes to a nice plateau for the next 100+ levels. It's not an expoential increase anymore.

At the very least, the epic monsters are pretty excellent world-shaking apocalypses. Each and every one has the potential to be the anchor of an entire campaign. And they're available for cheap as free in the SRD.

I'd say give in to pressure and keep it coming. Go planar. Use epic monsters. Design NPC's that rival the PC's in levels. They've solved the problems on their world -- now it's time to solve the problems in every world.

 

[Aluvial]

Seriously, your group sounds like the reason the Epic Level rules as they exist now were *created*. They want to keep doing the same things they've been doing since 1st level.

The good thing about epic levels, if you're already used to high-level powers, is that they aren't particularly complex. The amount of random buffs and bumps the PC's get is slow, steady, and predictable. Power after 20th level comes to a nice plateau for the next 100+ levels. It's not an expoential increase anymore.

At the very least, the epic monsters are pretty excellent world-shaking apocalypses. Each and every one has the potential to be the anchor of an entire campaign. And they're available for cheap as free in the SRD.

I'd say give in to pressure and keep it coming. Go planar. Use epic monsters. Design NPC's that rival the PC's in levels. They've solved the problems on their world -- now it's time to solve the problems in every world.

Yeah, I have the Epic book, and I've looked for all the other sources that people have recommended on this thread. I'm studying the book now, if I can just get another adventure put together, I will have something to finish the campaign with.

You know how it is, you want to give the players something memorable to end on, you don't just want to say, "... and you live happily ever after."

Thanks again everyone, your continued advice is well appreciated (as always!).

Aluvial

 

[ZuulMoG]

You might want to consider going Spell-Jammer and starting a new Beholder War (with Illithid Nautiloid allies for the psychic warrior, natch).

 

[Arrgh! Mark!]

All heroes die, eventually. Use a couple of those (Very good, I might add) threats from above. Don't be scared at making villains proactive, either.

What you should allow them to do is, as with all epic heroes, save the world and go out in a blaze of glory that lights the world forevermore*. All truly powerful heroes die, or at least are retired with a "Continually adventuring forevermore, your characters fade into the sunset."

Seriously, all good movies must end. Think of a truly epic plotline that can and will finish - death of characters or not.


In the vein of Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon, you might have your epic level characters start to interact with lower-level NPCs. (Got a Paladin with a Holy Avenger? Have a LG rogue steal it so as to save her village or some such.) I could just see it. Paladin vs. Rogue, paladin with normal sword or a stick. "If you can defeat me in three moves.." (Whack. Whack. Whack. Down goes the Lvl 1 rogue. Paladin gets new squire.)

End it, but let the squires and heirs continue the battle against the original unstoppable odds.

*Until the 1st level party members accidentally trip that seal the epic characters died to hide.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hello again!

Here are over 200 epic monsters:

http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?p=2431689#post2431689

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey Aluvial!

Yeah, I have the Epic book, and I've looked for all the other sources that people have recommended on this thread. I'm studying the book now, if I can just get another adventure put together, I will have something to finish the campaign with.

I don't know why you are so eager to finish? After all "Life begins at 40th!"

Don't be afraid of getting your hands dirty, if major aspects of the campaign world get changed because of the actions of the PCs, then run with it. At epic level you have to embrace epic consequences, not shy away from them.

You know how it is, you want to give the players something memorable to end on, you don't just want to say, "... and you live happily ever after."

I don't understand the mentality of giving up if everyone is still having fun with the existing characters.

Thanks again everyone, your continued advice is well appreciated (as always!).

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey there!

All heroes die, eventually.

Not necessarily, they may very well be immortals.

Use a couple of those (Very good, I might add) threats from above. Don't be scared at making villains proactive, either.

Absolutely.

What you should allow them to do is, as with all epic heroes, save the world and go out in a blaze of glory that lights the world forevermore*.

I must have missed that bit in the Epic Level Handbook where it suggests when the PCs get to 21st-level; run one more adventure during which you kill them all off, arbitrarily if necessary.

All truly powerful heroes die, or at least are retired with a "Continually adventuring forevermore, your characters fade into the sunset."

Didn't you ever wonder what they were getting up to on their continued adventuring?

Seriously, all good movies must end.

Movies are adventures though, not campaigns. A television series is more like a campaign, and if the ratings are still high enough they'll commission more series. In this case, the players are interested in doing a second series.

Think of a truly epic plotline that can and will finish - death of characters or not.

Oerth gets blown up by the Death Star.

In the vein of Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon, you might have your epic level characters start to interact with lower-level NPCs. (Got a Paladin with a Holy Avenger? Have a LG rogue steal it so as to save her village or some such.) I could just see it. Paladin vs. Rogue, paladin with normal sword or a stick. "If you can defeat me in three moves.." (Whack. Whack. Whack. Down goes the Lvl 1 rogue. Paladin gets new squire.)

End it, but let the squires and heirs continue the battle against the original unstoppable odds.

*Until the 1st level party members accidentally trip that seal the epic characters died to hide.

Its a cop-out.

 

[Ellie_the_Elf]

Ellie, very glad to hear that you enjoyed the Quicksilver Hourglass! Not to hijack this thread, but, as the author, I'm naturally curious to hear a bit more about how it played for you.



#123

Hi, and thanks for a great adventure

I'll start a new thread so as not to hijack/spoil it for those who haven't played it yet!

Ellie