I have Heroes of Shadows

[Nausicaa]

The first refers to taking damage if it doesn't move. The latter takes damage if it moves on it's turn, but doesn't refer to willingly. So, if a bard put the daily on him that causes him to be unable to take move actions but get slid at start/end of his turn, for example, then he'd take the damage from sliding.

In both cases, the damage is fixed (2 + your secondary stat).

He'll take damage for sliding and from hypnotic pattern, or from defender mark triggering (if it slides, naturally).

The damage won't be high at higher level but i suppose those are low-level effects. 6 kicker damage only for moving can't be ignored at level 1.

Could you please write me a couple of dailies? I know i'm very bothering x_x

 

[UngeheuerLich]

It's really not and I couldn't disagree with this idea more if I tried. The vampire being so on rails makes it one of the most bland and uninteresting classes in 4E. There will be no diversity practically between any two players and that's just boring.

Oh, of course it is...

not for the experienced player, but for new players of course...

taking quotes out of context is not a good way to prove something or someone wrong...

I posted the follwing sentence elsewhere or i accidently cut it from my post, so i repeat it here:

"New multiclass rules and themes may make or break the vampire. "

If they get revised in a sensible way, the vampire will have enough choices...

 

[gyor]

They are trying to build a guide to blackguards and vampires at the wotc forums. The vampire one doesn't seem like it has a lot of stuff in it, except humour, although I gave a few suggestions. Are vampire as weak as they say?
What is they're level 29 like and thier upper level assult power do for damage?

 

[WalterKovacs]

Could you please write me a couple of dailies? I know i'm very bothering x_x

For binders I'm assuming?

At level 1 you have a choice of a single target ranged attack. It does force damage and ongoing (on a hit), and the enemy can take a move action to make an opposed Acro or Athletics check against you to end the damage (or save). The other is an area burst 1, deals necro damage and immobilizes (save ends) on a hit, half damage and slows (save ends) on a miss, as an effect it creates an encounter long zone which immobilizes until EoNT any creature that willingly enters the zone.

At 5 you have a choice of a single target ranged attack, effectively reliable, deals cold damage and slows (s/e) on a hit. The other is an area burst 1, deals necrotic damage and slow (s/e) on a hit, as an effect creates an encounterlong zone which gives you an at-will OA that triggers off an enemy entering the zone willingly or ending it's turn there. It deals fixed damage (5+Cha mod necro) and slows (s/e). If they are already slow when you hit them with that power it instead immobilizes and 10 ongoing necro (s/e both).

 

[kaomera]

not for the experienced player, but for new players of course...

I don't think it matters if you're an experienced player or a new player. Some new players may well benefit from additional simplicity, but others are going to want the same choices as "everybody else". Meanwhile, I'm an experienced player and the vampire totally doesn't bother me on the basis that it's very pre-fab. Sure, if we had a party with several vampires it could, possibly get a bit stale. But most of the play I'm actually interested in happens at the table, not in front of the CB, so what you do with your "stuff" means a lot more to me than what "stuff" you've got.

The vampire is an option (actually there are still some meaningful choices to be made, but let's gloss over that distinction for a second). Most other classes, when you compare them on this basis, are a whole bunch of options. I can totally see an argument that the vampire is less efficient use of space than a class like the blackguard. But it's not like it's bad design just because it has fewer decision points during character creation, IMO.

 

[WalterKovacs]

They are trying to build a guide to blackguards and vampires at the wotc forums. The vampire one doesn't seem like it has a lot of stuff in it, except humour, although I gave a few suggestions. Are vampire as weak as they say?
What is they're level 29 like and thier upper level assult power do for damage?

29 -> 7d6+dex mod damage to each target (all enemies in close blast 5).

Their 17 encounter deals 3d12+Dex mod against a single target. Spending a surge either makes it all enemies in close blast 1 or deals 3d10 extra damage to a single target.

 

[Aegeri]

"New multiclass rules and themes may make or break the vampire. "

That's a sure way of ensuring it's doomed. Wizards have been pretty bad at supporting anything outside of Wizards/Clerics/Fighters for a while now. Look at the Runepriest, Artificer, Seeker and DDI Assassin who have all been out for a considerable amount of time and left to die. It's becoming pretty clear the idea that all classes should see regular support in 4E no longer exists.

So if the Vampire is a limited on rails class now, that's exactly how it is going to remain until 5E is published.

You do realize, of course, that sometimes, there will be a DM around to say no to this idea.

DM's are entirely welcome not to follow RAW and arbitrarily punish someone for spending something like 5 feats minimum (IIRC) to do this. It's not like vampire powers are very good (the opposite in fact), but at least this way some of their more neat stuff can get used. Especially in my games this is probably the only way I could see them being used. I honestly don't see anyone ever playing a vampire any time soon, unless they were willing to put in the work optimizing it so it was oassassin levels of bad.

 

[LordArchaon]

Blackguard till 4th level?

First of all, many many thanks to the lucky ones with the book for their patience in answering all the questions! I've never get past a n00b status here on EN World, so I don't know how to give xp or comment single posts, but... Yeah.

My question might as well have a null answer: what does the Blackguard get at 3rd level? Or 4th? I guess next to nothing, but I would appreciate it very much if somebody could tell me that, for I'm going to build one for a PbP adventure!

Oh, I guess the 2nd level utilities would be icing on the cake, maybe just the Fury one if they're too long..? Thank you very much!

 

[WalterKovacs]

First of all, many many thanks to the lucky ones with the book for their patience in answering all the questions! I've never get past a n00b status here on EN World, so I don't know how to give xp or comment single posts, but... Yeah.

My question might as well have a null answer: what does the Blackguard get at 3rd level? Or 4th? I guess next to nothing, but I would appreciate it very much if somebody could tell me that, for I'm going to build one for a PbP adventure!

Oh, I guess the 2nd level utilities would be icing on the cake, maybe just the Fury one if they're too long..? Thank you very much!

At 2 they get Vice's Reward. It's an encounter power that gives temp hitpoints, a saving throw and a bonus to defenses until end of next turn.

At 3 they get a second use of Dread Smite.

At 4 they get their Servant of Vice, daily conjuration which can be asked questions, and also serves as a means of getting combat advantage.

 

[LordArchaon]

At 2 they get Vice's Reward. It's an encounter power that gives temp hitpoints, a saving throw and a bonus to defenses until end of next turn.

At 3 they get a second use of Dread Smite.

At 4 they get their Servant of Vice, daily conjuration which can be asked questions, and also serves as a means of getting combat advantage.

Whoa, that was quick, thanks! I feel stupid though, it had already been previewed mostly! Strangely enough, second level is the most problematic... It's actually not swappable? I mean, it doesn't specify 2nd level in the power entry? And can you actually stat the bonuses? Thanks again!