I like 3E, but I miss...

[Gnarlo]

I miss that special feeling that we were doing something new, exciting, and different. It was like being part of a secret club of mages, that we and we alone had discovered this new magic and were determined to wrest out all its secrets.

That, and I miss being young, quick, having a full head of hair, and being in middle school and not having any responsibilities except going to school during the day and spending the evenings gaming or planning on gaming.

Don't know which of the two reasons take first place

 

[Shadeus]

"As much as I like 3E, when thinking back to 1st or 2nd edition AD&D, I have to admit that I miss _____________."

Gary Gygax

Although Gary is still around, it's not the same as when he was running the show.

 

[Wormwood]

"As much as I like 3E, when thinking back to 1st or 2nd edition AD&D, I have to admit that I miss _____________."

A small part of me is wistful for the the lower hit points, magic item rarity and "roll 3d6 once for each stat in order" of 1e.

I wouldn't trade any of them for the ramped-up action and myriad options of 3+, mind you.

But it *was* a simpler game in my salad days.

 

[Richards]

Definitely the artwork. Oh, for the days when PCs weren't covered in tattoos, multiple body piercings, and spikes, and monsters actually looked like their descriptions!

Johnathan

 

[jester47]

If I had to miss somthing, I miss the Easly coveres and the sheer strangeness of 1E. I don't miss 2E a bit.

Aaron

 

[astralpwka]

I liked the random dungeon in the 1E DMG. I spent a lot of would-be bored time taking solo characters or groups all controlled by myself through random dungeons. I've kept my 1E book just for that dungeon.

 

[Tyler Do'Urden]

I really miss the look of 2e... the feel of 90's RPGs, with their lower (yet higher than 80's) production values gave the books a different sort of ambience- especially D&D and Earthdawn. The only 3e books I've seen which have brought back that feeling are the Arcana Unearthed books. The 3e art just looks like a video game.

I miss the huge adventures that were more than dungeon crawls... even though the dungeon crawls were great too.

Planescape, undoubtably... even though 3e has settings that I like as well or better (Diamond Throne, Midnight, Oathbound, WoT)

Sourcebooks that were more than just encyclopedias of power-ups.

Of course, despite all that, there's lots of stuff I don't miss-

THAC0

Useless low-level wizards

Inflexible classes that a character was stuck in for it's entire career.

Unbalanced kits.

Exceptional strength.

Terribly abusable brawling and called shot rules.

Racial class restrictions that made no sense (Elves can't be Druids or Bards? Pixies can't be Mages?)

The Humanoids Handbook- nothing in there was balanced. ECL is a much better mechanic- and generally discourages most players from playing non-core races, other than the occasional Tiefling, Drow, or Half-Celestial)

While I really liked the Player's Option series, I often had to write a book of modifications and errata just to turn 2e into a game that I could actually want to play or run. I certainly don't miss that. D&D 3e plays right out of the box- I hardly have to tweak it at all. It's like a swiss watch compared to the old system.

So, on balance, I'll take 3e over 2e any day of the week and sunday, even if I do miss the old aesthetics... and Planescape.

 

[Wombat]

I'm the wrong person to ask, but I'll answer anyway

I played D&D, but dropped out when it turned to AD&D because the whole game had gotten, well, rather silly.

I switched to RuneQuest

Later I switched to Ars Magica and Over the Edge

I have been playing 3e, but won't bother to switch to 3.5, because the mechanics were cleaner than in the past and, after a move, it was much easier to get a D&D group together than anything else.

So what do I miss from 1st & 2nd ed AD&D?

Mucha nada...

 

[Staffan]

... Dark Sun.

Speaking of which, I just got off my butt (well, not literally...) and posted my outline for a Dark Sun conversion in the Conversions forum. Everyone's welcome to take a look at it and comment.

 

[Achan hiArusa]

From the Red Box D&D I miss the quick character creation. In D&D you rolled your ability scores, you choose your character class, you picked a basic character class equipment set, if you were a wizard you choose your two spells, and you had a character. AD&D 1E broke the races and classes into different steps which slowed creation down a little bit (and allowed wizards a wider variety of spells to start with), then Unearthed Arcana introduced subraces, new classes, new equipment, and new spells which slowed things down even further, AND they didn't have equipment kits like Basic D&D. The wilderness survival guide and the dungeoneer's survival guide added proficiencies which really, really slowed down character creation. The 2nd ed Player's Handbook sped things up a little bit by putting stuff in one place again (though I still complain about how they nerfed clerics, druids, and rangers). Then the Complete Handbooks came out and introduced kits which again slowed down character creation (not to mention if someone wanted to Psionicist, then everyone ended up waiting around for the Psi player). Then the Player's Option books came out, with its point pimping system, character creation slowed to a crawl (almost as bad as Champions).

The Slowest part of 3e and 3.5e is the skill system. You have to allocate skill points, determine racial bonuses, class bonuses, feat bonuses, and synergy bonuses. That also applies to determining saving throws, base attack bonus, and initiative. With the staggering amount of choice in equipment, spells, feats, and skills players spent a lot of time creating their characters. And if they player wants to modify the basics of his class like the example at the end of the heroic characteristics chapter then it gets even longer.

Even combat is slower, with different types of combat options, and rules everywhere. Even the critical system slows down combat.

Sigh, I would check out Savage Worlds except my Players would never make the switch, and I like D&D too much. Maybe it has a few good ideas.

Sincerely,




Sammy Grimes