I like the new approach on magic items

[fuindordm]

The intention may be to prevent magic items from completely disrupting the economy. The market prices of 3E items were often ridiculous in both directions, and I found the 1XP=5GP conversion really distasteful. Still, it made sense that in a world where XP could be converted into something of material worth, XP would become another currency.

On the other hand, it makes much more sense for PCs to be creating magic items using well-defined rules that just leaving it to DM fiat. 1st edition, for example, had *tons* of potions, scrolls, wands, and other more powerful items floating around in the world--yet somehow, the creation of such items was reserved for the most experienced characters. It was really silly that you needed a 7th level wizard and an alchemist to create even the most minor potions, and patently ridiculous that you needed a 7th level wizard to scribe scrolls. When something like a 15th level wizard is needed to make a +1 sword, you have to wonder where the party's equipment could possibly have come from!

If I had my druthers, I'd like to see item creation associated with three costs:

1. time (do the demands of the plot allow it?)
2. exotic components (are you willing to take a side quest, or hire someone to do so?)
3. personal sacrifice (XP is actually a very good choice here, but one could also consider the permanent loss of HP and even ability scores for very powerful items.)

Gold should also be spent, but in much smaller amounts to represent research.

It never bothered me one tiny bit that spellcasters had to put out all the XP themselves. I like the mythological aspect of item creation it encourages... that permanent power has to come from somewhere. An XP cost may not be desirable for one-shot items, so that NPCs can believably provide them to the PCs. For players who want another solution, I would be happy to reveal the existence of special sites or items that allowed other characters to contribute, willingly or unwillingly, with extreme alignment consequences for the latter.

Cheers!

 

[Korgoth]

There is still gold piece cost to control when and how much magic will be made. Thats been far more of a control in the games I DMed and played in than XP's ever were.

Plus, if its like I suggested, A DM will have an oppening to require "special components" that the DM will be able to control however much they wish, there by controlling magic item creation even better than gold and XP's ever did.

Of course now we will hear cries of "uber jerk DM's who control everything". As if the 3E rules ever stopped such a thing.

I always liked the way it was in the 1E DMG: you had to get a bunch of kooky magical components that the DM decided upon based on his campaign.

"You must combine the powdered horn of a narwhal, 2 stones from the gizzard of a giant owl from the Withered Peaks and 17 jewels that have been desired by a princess" is a lot cooler to me than "OK, shell out 200xp and 8,000gp, bub."

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

I liked 3.x's approach to magic items much more than the previous editions. The formulas were guidelines from day 1, not cut-and-dry systems.

I'll have to learn more of what they're doing in 4e, but what this sounds like a negative to me.

Agreed.

I thought 3.X's magic item creation system was one of its strongest aspects. I hated the fact that in order to make a +1 sword, you needed to gather steel blessed by the dwarven gods and quench the blade in water flowing from the Mystic Spring du Jour.

An artifact blade? Sign me up for the epic quest.

A +2 Ring of Protection? Not so much.

 

[Slife]

It never bothered me one tiny bit that spellcasters had to put out all the XP themselves. I like the mythological aspect of item creation it encourages... that permanent power has to come from somewhere. An XP cost may not be desirable for one-shot items, so that NPCs can believably provide them to the PCs. For players who want another solution, I would be happy to reveal the existence of special sites or items that allowed other characters to contribute, willingly or unwillingly, with extreme alignment consequences for the latter.

Cheers!

There are rules around that. IIRC, there's a spell, item, and feat you can use to transfer XP. The feat is even a freebie - you get it after making five of the items.

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060526a

 

[Klaus]

There are rules around that. IIRC, there's a spell, item, and feat you can use to transfer XP. The feat is even a freebie - you get it after making five of the items.

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060526a

And even without those, THAT part (caster pays XP) can be easily house ruled. In my game I required that the PC comissioning an item paid the XP, not the crafting NPC.

In fact, that opened the door for evil wizards to syphon off life energy (XP) from unwilling victims to build the World Burninator 3000.

 

[F4NBOY]

In fact, that opened the door for evil wizards to syphon off life energy (XP) from unwilling victims to build the World Burninator 3000.

I know that's a joke, but it would be interesting, maybe not to 4E standard rules, that in order to create a magic item, the character would need to invest his personal power into it, but instead of XP ability score pts. So in order to craft an item, the crafter would receive a permanent penalty to one of his ability scores, but the penalty would not take effect if the creater would stay in possession of that item. If he loses it or sells it, than the penalty takes effect.
Of course, evil characters could have some special ability to drain that power from other people.

But back to the topic, has anyone found another tibit of how magic items will be handled in 4e?

 

[Irda Ranger]

I thought 3.X's magic item creation system was one of its strongest aspects. I hated the fact that in order to make a +1 sword, you needed to gather steel blessed by the dwarven gods and quench the blade in water flowing from the Mystic Spring du Jour.

An artifact blade? Sign me up for the epic quest.

A +2 Ring of Protection? Not so much.

Sorry, but I feel just the opposite. Magic should be earned, not bought and sold like ordinary steel. I know that wasn't how everyone played the game, but that's how I played it - and that's how I liked it.

I'm looking forward to 4e.

 

[Starglim]

The new approach is not to have an approach. It doesn't sound as if they have a clue how to work it yet.

 

[WarlockLord]

I didn't like the 3e XP costs. It didn't make sense (you give up a part of your soul) when contrasted with the fact that every Joe Blow has about 50 magical items.

I suspect, with the new encounter-recharge system, magic items will be used a lot less. And it always felt cheesy to me to over-rely on magic items (I can only use my PrC features with the ring of evasion). I'd rather have the characters just focus on class and have magic items be rare.

However, a formula to prevent a 1st level wizard from crafting a +20 vorpal flaming shock corrosive enervating weapon would be nice, probably necessary, as at least ONE idiot DM is going to let a player get away with it.

 

[Maldor]

Korgoth
I always liked the way it was in the 1E DMG: you had to get a bunch of kooky magical components that the DM decided upon based on his campaign.

"You must combine the powdered horn of a narwhal, 2 stones from the gizzard of a giant owl from the Withered Peaks and 17 jewels that have been desired by a princess" is a lot cooler to me than "OK, shell out 200xp and 8,000gp, bub."

i don't know anything about 4th yet but i played 2nd with this BS at Level 15 i had made 1 magic item in 2 1/2 years of game play. never made a scroll or potion not 1 it took the ink of a kracken to make a scroll of read magic. it was stupid. it was easier to kill the god hold that nice artfact then to make a +2 shortsword.