Negative Zero
First Post
ironically, this is exactly the impression that i got from Neo's telephone speech at the end of the first movie, but was nowhere to be found in the second.
go figure.
~NegZ
go figure.
~NegZ
I saw the MATRIX 2 thread SPOILERS ABOUND
- Thread starter KChagga
- Start date
Mathew_Freeman
Adventurer
Well, the Wachowski's didn't know if there was going to be a sequel until the first one was the success it was, so they had to finish the Matrix 1 off in a good way. Which they did. Besides, it doesn't really make a difference. That phone speech still fits in with the start of Matrix 2, ie Neo telling the machines "this is how it's going to begin" to "we've rescued more in the past 6 months than in the past couple of years" or whatever the quote is.
Well, except for the part where this film is thought provoking, rooted in philosophy (however badly you think it's presented or dealt with in the film) and a bit more than an 80's Hollywood Action film, where Sly/Arnie/whoever kills an incredible number of people.
Well, except for the part where this film is thought provoking, rooted in philosophy (however badly you think it's presented or dealt with in the film) and a bit more than an 80's Hollywood Action film, where Sly/Arnie/whoever kills an incredible number of people.
WayneLigon
Adventurer
Salthanas said:
Maybe Morpheus is the Oracle. Didn't they say he was a changed man when he left from his interview with her? Maybe she can infect minds as well, like Smith did, and what's been riding around in Morpheus' skull is The Oracle.
Mathew_Freeman
Adventurer
WayneLigon said:
OK, that's officially the strangest, yet possibly most interesting bit of speculation I've heard so far.
krunchyfrogg
Explorer
Mathew_Freeman
Adventurer
I like it.
Worth reading, if only for the way he refutes the Matrix-within-a-Matrix theorey at the end.
Worth reading, if only for the way he refutes the Matrix-within-a-Matrix theorey at the end.
Black Omega
First Post
Interesting reading, but I'm not sure he refutes anything. Why doesn't Smith change the humans appearance as well as mentally taking him over? That would defeat the point of why he is doing it, infiltration.
Why would the machines need to reload the Matrix if they had a new improved, perfectly functioning matrix in Zion? Because it's not. From the movie, Zion gets reset each time they reload. So it's no more perfect than the rest of the matrix, instead it's a necessary part of the reload process.
I do agree with him that Zion as part of the matrix creates problems. And it solves others. No matter how you look at it something doesn't fit.
Why would the machines need to reload the Matrix if they had a new improved, perfectly functioning matrix in Zion? Because it's not. From the movie, Zion gets reset each time they reload. So it's no more perfect than the rest of the matrix, instead it's a necessary part of the reload process.
I do agree with him that Zion as part of the matrix creates problems. And it solves others. No matter how you look at it something doesn't fit.
reapersaurus
Explorer
You don't think?!
Just the fact that so much can be discussed about the movie is an indicator of how good Revolutions was, regardless what many people are saying.
It's amazing to me sometimes how people can build up their expectations so high, that nothing would satisfy them.
And my opinion is that the Matrix-within-a-Matrix theory will not turn out to be true, nor the food-as-virus theory.
The religious theories are very interesting, also the Councilman as one of the 23.
A question:
They show 250,000 squids out in force against Zion.
What exactly does Zion have to defend itself?
Have they detailed that anywhere?
Cause it sure seems to me that with the power the machines have (that 250k is not all the forces they have), they should be able to slaughter the humans without trying too hard.
Have they even shown how a ship can take out a SQUID?
I presumed the EMP was a last-gasp measure, not THE way they end up taking out one of the 250K arrayed against them.
I just finish reading this thread, it was a very good time but I can't believe no one mention one thing I found the other day.
In the Enter the Matrix game there's a lot of videos with the real actors that shows you the other side of the history, you have one scene where you see several people dead and Bane (the guy infected by Smith) moving around them, then you see the reaction of the people on the ship that rescue him and the others (think it's The Hammer)
Anyway this videos add to the history but aren't really essential to understand the movie, but there's one video that talks about somethig that I never see or read anywhere, near the end of the game (I was playing as Ghost the guy on the Logos, the ship of Niobe) you see a video where the Logos got a call from the Matrix and they don't know who could be because they lost connection with Neo, Trinity and Morpheus after they blow out the energy plant, they answer the call and it's Seraph telling them that they must go and see the Oracle.
At this point you leave the video and enter the game where you have to fight with Seraph, if you loss you miss the video and the game goes on, if you win then you see a full video of the character you're playing visiting the Oracle (I haven't reach that part with Niobe yet and don't know if the Oracle says the same to her), besides you see the real actors on the game the Oracle it's played by another woman, from what I know the woman playing the Oracle dies on September 01 so that's why they use this actress I don't think it's a mislead since Seraph guides you to the Oracle.
Anyway basically what the Oracle told to Ghost that it's important to the history is this:
Ghost: Who are you?
Oracle: I'm the Oracle. I can tell you that I remember bits & pieces of my past
Ghost: What happened to you?
Oracle: Two Programs that I trusted sold the termination code of my orginal shell to the Merovingian
Ghost: Why?
Oracle: For love, for the life of their child
Ghost: You knew and let that happend?
Oracle: Had to. The child is important, I can't tell you why but I believe that one day the child will change both our world and your world forever
Then Ghost ask if that's why she calls him and the Oracle says no and explains that she's trying to prepare some people for the "impending trial" [not sure about the words here]
Soooooooo I can't believe when I saw this the first time, seems something that should be on Revolutions and maybe this is a hint but a strong one, remember that the game was written by the brothers so this reference is really weird, think you'll like to know about it.
Two programs having childs?
Neo and Trinity are those programs that the Oracle trusted?
If the above it's true then the theory of the Matrix within the Matrix sounds correct cause Neo and Trinity are programs
I don't know what to think of this right now, I would like to see your opinions about it.
Cazador
In the Enter the Matrix game there's a lot of videos with the real actors that shows you the other side of the history, you have one scene where you see several people dead and Bane (the guy infected by Smith) moving around them, then you see the reaction of the people on the ship that rescue him and the others (think it's The Hammer)
Anyway this videos add to the history but aren't really essential to understand the movie, but there's one video that talks about somethig that I never see or read anywhere, near the end of the game (I was playing as Ghost the guy on the Logos, the ship of Niobe) you see a video where the Logos got a call from the Matrix and they don't know who could be because they lost connection with Neo, Trinity and Morpheus after they blow out the energy plant, they answer the call and it's Seraph telling them that they must go and see the Oracle.
At this point you leave the video and enter the game where you have to fight with Seraph, if you loss you miss the video and the game goes on, if you win then you see a full video of the character you're playing visiting the Oracle (I haven't reach that part with Niobe yet and don't know if the Oracle says the same to her), besides you see the real actors on the game the Oracle it's played by another woman, from what I know the woman playing the Oracle dies on September 01 so that's why they use this actress I don't think it's a mislead since Seraph guides you to the Oracle.
Anyway basically what the Oracle told to Ghost that it's important to the history is this:
Ghost: Who are you?
Oracle: I'm the Oracle. I can tell you that I remember bits & pieces of my past
Ghost: What happened to you?
Oracle: Two Programs that I trusted sold the termination code of my orginal shell to the Merovingian
Ghost: Why?
Oracle: For love, for the life of their child
Ghost: You knew and let that happend?
Oracle: Had to. The child is important, I can't tell you why but I believe that one day the child will change both our world and your world forever
Then Ghost ask if that's why she calls him and the Oracle says no and explains that she's trying to prepare some people for the "impending trial" [not sure about the words here]
Soooooooo I can't believe when I saw this the first time, seems something that should be on Revolutions and maybe this is a hint but a strong one, remember that the game was written by the brothers so this reference is really weird, think you'll like to know about it.
Two programs having childs?
Neo and Trinity are those programs that the Oracle trusted?
If the above it's true then the theory of the Matrix within the Matrix sounds correct cause Neo and Trinity are programs
I don't know what to think of this right now, I would like to see your opinions about it.
Cazador
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