(IR) The 5th IR - 3rd OOC Thread (OPEN)

[Kalanyr]

Kalanyr, even if Morwel is a demigoddess, the Book of Exalted Deeds says that any of the Celestial Paragons would be considered the weakest of demigods at all. So, a compromise might be to make Morwel a powerful hero deity and take Ye'Cind -- who is from Oerth to begin with. Possibly, she arrives at the request of Ye'Cind.

I have problems seeing the ruler of a planar race bowing to a demigod to be honest, though this is the way 3rd Edition went, in 1e they were usually roughly lesser powers. [joke]My hat of massive retconning knoweth no limits[/joke]. Still I'll go with whatever Serpenteye decides. I'll probably relinquish YeCind if Morwel is accepted as a demipower simply because 2 demigods is probably 1 to many for a single faction.

I made a few suggestions to you on Gigantea. (The goliaths from Races of Stone would be a nice addition. Also, I made a few suggestions for Hyperborea. I have Frostburn, and there is a lot in that which would work there. Imagine the site of war mammoths heading south from the tundra!)

I have Frostburn and Races of Stone so I'll be sure to have a look at both (I've had them for a couple of months but haven't found time to sit down and read them). (I also need to catch up on my purchases and get Shining South, Complete Arcane and the Libris Mortis).

 

[William Ronald]

Well, every spell will have a means around it. So, I think that such a means likely exists even for Apocalypse from the Skies. Also, Apocalypse from the Sky does weaken the caster a bit. (Heck, in most cases, it should leave the caster so weak that he becomes easy prey for a determined enemy. Not to mention that interrupting the spellcasting ruins the spell completely.) Stone houses will prevent damage, and the casting time is one day. So, the spell does have some drawbacks. A single Hiroshima like bomb can do more damage in a limited area. (OOC: I developed a counter for the spell in my previous campaign. So, a counter to the spell could be developed easily. My solution was a form of high level abjuration. It is an evil spell, so abjuration magic would work. It did for a 35th level wizard I played for a long time.)

Mind you, I do expect Vecna to be deadly. Mind you, I think it would also be possible to create a sanctified version of the Apocalypse from the Sky Spell using force or holy power. Mind you, there would be more limitations using it.

AIRWHALE AND ZELDA:
[sblock]
The unoccupied embassy is yours if you wish? Zelda, have you read the communications between Airwhale and myself? They have some proposals for your faction, especially for trade and diplomacy.
[/sblock]

BUGBEAR
[sblock]
I will ask for Venus to meet with you in Ekbir. Maybe we can do this soon. Public post for everything? Or public and sblocks?[/sblock]


VENUS:
[sblock]Can I write a public post to set the stage for the meeting with King Ogrim Scarseer, King Seth Rhynnon, and Al'Akbar. Public post for everything? Or public and sblocks?[/sblock]

 

[William Ronald]

Kalanyr, I am more partial to Ye'Cind than Morwel, because Ye'Cind was born on Oerth. (I am uncertain if Serpenteye will allow planar rulers to arrive. Mind you, the BoED does say that the Celestial Paragons generally direct clerics to good-aligned deities.) However, maybe Thomas Hobbes or another elven player can take Ye'Cind if you take Morwel. (I like what James Heard did with Ye'Cind, and I would like to interact with such a character. Plus, unlike Morwel who was born immortal, Ye'Cind at least remembers what it was like to live as a mortal.)

Kalanyr, I think the good and neutral races from Frostburn and Races of Stone would work well. I can make some quick recommendations to you via e-mail or chat.

Bugbear, as usual, you make good points. Also, while I have not looked at the IR character stats, Dragon Magazine 295 did have stats for Iuz. Apocalypse from the Sky would really hurt that version of Iuz, who has a constitution of 26.

 

[Darkness]

Well, every spell will have a means around it. So, I think that such a means likely exists even for Apocalypse from the Skies.

How about using the artifact destruction guidelines from Mordenkainen's disjunction:

... if an artifact is destroyed, you must make a DC 25 Will save or permanently loseall spellcasting abilities. (These abilities cannot be recovered by mortal magic, not even miracle or wish.)
Note: Destroying artifacts is a dangerous business, and it is 95% likely to attract the attention of some powerful being who has an interest in or connection with the device

 

[Gurdjieff]

VENUS:
[sblock]Can I write a public post to set the stage for the meeting with King Ogrim Scarseer, King Seth Rhynnon, and Al'Akbar. Public post for everything? Or public and sblocks?[/sblock]

WILLIAM:
[sblock]If you have the time to do so, please do. Much appreciated. Public is fine. Sblocks aren't required.[/sblock]

 

[Bugbear]

Mind you, I do expect Vecna to be deadly. Mind you, I think it would also be possible to create a sanctified version of the Apocalypse from the Sky Spell using force or holy power. Mind you, there would be more limitations using it.

That's what i meant by removing the vile (or is it corrupt) discriptor. I don't have the BOED, but if there isn't a "good" version oof this spell, there should be.

BUGBEAR
I will ask for Venus to meet with you in Ekbir. Maybe we can do this soon. Public post for everything? Or public and sblocks?

Certanly, this should be done on the boards. Public of course as I'm not a big fan of Sblocks. I'll start working up a post and should have it ready by tomorow.

 

[Kalanyr]

I can understand that, as I said I'll bow to Serpenteyes rulings. I just lean the other way on such things.

Feel free to email me with recommendations I'm unlikely to make it to chat before you go to bed.

 

[Edena_of_Neith]

It is a beautiful map, James.

To everyone: but how do we color it? I know the claims and geography well enough to color it, if I only had the tools to do so.

Is there anyone who can save that map to their computer? Who could convert it into something that could be colored in?
Guilt Puppy did this with the small map. Is there anyone who can do it with James' large map?

- - -

William, that's a nice little prison you devised for my drow. Complete with watchtowers! (A nice plush courtyard and amenities ... surrounded on all sides by high walls and watchtowers manned by Ekbir ... that's a prison.)
The drow know it, too.
The drow, aren't real happy about it, either. They don't say a word, but Eclavdra knows what has been done.

 

[William Ronald]

A meeting in Ekbir

That's what i meant by removing the vile (or is it corrupt) discriptor. I don't have the BOED, but if there isn't a "good" version oof this spell, there should be.


Certanly, this should be done on the boards. Public of course as I'm not a big fan of Sblocks. I'll start working up a post and should have it ready by tomorow.

(OOC: I agree that sblocks tend to take a bit away from the casual reader of the IR checking this out. I told Venus that I would probably wait till tomorrow but I will set the scene now. It is assumed that this may be private, or semi-private. So, the basic information will likely come out after the meeting as opposed to a big public broadcast of it.)

Shortly after the embassy of Orcreich and the Khanates was opened, Al'Akbar returned to the Palace of the Caliph of Ekbir, his temporary seat of government. The great council chamber of the Palace of the Caliph of Ekbir was being prepared for the meeting. Al'Akbar looked over plans for a great structure on the outskirts of the city, wrote a few remarks, and handed the plans over to an architect.

The hall was luxurious with a round table of oak, polished and set with gold and gems. There were several great chairs set for the guests. Al'Akbar turned to Caliph Xargun of Ekbir.

"I realize welcoming the drow was somewhat challenging. However, I believe that maintainign contact with them is wise. For it may benefit both of our peoples in the struggle to come. Mind you, there are several embassies nearby in case there are difficulties. There may be some areas for cooperation, but it is wise to remember the nature of drow soceity and the faith of their temporal leader," Al'Akbar's voice was calm, but his visage was stern.

Xargun nodded, and looked out a window towards the embassies. The embassies of Greater Nyrond and Orcreich were both larger than that of Eclavdor. The towers surrounding the drow embassy glittered. "The towers surrounding the plaza are also well equipped. After all, our new guests may need our protection. Or we may need to protect others from them."

"I hope that all will go well with the meeting this morning, Al'Akbar. May the guests arrive soon and may this meeting be a blessing upon us all. Is the hall suitable?"

"There is none finer in Ekbir. Also, I would like to thank you for your hospitality, Caliph Xargun. I plan to build a place for myself on the outskirts of the city. A retreat for some peace and quiet."

"I am honored, my lord and god, by your praise. As for hospitality, it is you who honors me. As a priest, it is a comfort to have my god at my side. As a Caliph, it is good to see our people standing as one. May it be that others will stand with us, as Orcreich and the Khanates have done."

"Indeed, that is my hope, Xargun. There will be great struggles ahead of us. Your own efforts and those of others to reunite the Baklunish peoples in the last few decades has helped my task considerably."

"Thank you, Emperor Al'Akbar!" Xargun said. "Well, I must go as there is much for me to do."
The Caliph of Ekbir bowed and left the room as Al'Akbar awaited for his guests to arrive and be led into the hall.

 

[Edena_of_Neith]

My point concerning the 9th level spell was this:

Let's say you'all decide to eliminate my power on Turn 1. And you combine your Elite and Epic PL to do it. My power is not strong enough to survive, and no help arrives to save my power.
Since the drow are going down anyways, Eclavdra has nothing to lose (see below.)
Eclavdra punishes the 3 worst offending powers by detonating the 9th level spell three consecutive times, with Wish spells cast priorhand to enable her to survive the process.
Let's say the three worst offenders were the Baklunish Empire, the League of Athyr, and the Illithid of the Underdark.
The Baklunish Empire and League of Athyr are reduced to ashes. (That much fire pouring from the sky produces a massive firestorm, folks, with sucks the oxygen out of stone houses and even underground shelters, axphixiating those within. And the intense heat of the fire produces radiant heat that fries creatures within stone shelters at the surface, and even fries people in underground shelters. Only beings deep underground, or in deep shelters, survive.)
The third spell produces a massive underground fire that scours endless thousands of miles of the Underdark, sweeping the tunnels, caves, and caverns free of all beings over hundreds of thousand of cubic miles. The Illithid, and everything else around, all perish. The Aboleth perish as their lakes boil in the intense heat.

At the end of this, Eclavdra - knowing she has failed and faces eternal damnation from Lolth - stabs herself with a Morganti Blade, which kills her and devours her soul. Sweet oblivion takes her, and she is freed from Lolth's wrath.
Nor can Eclavdra be wished back or resurrected. 10th level magic might work, but nothing less.

This grim scenario is what I call the Suicide Scenario, or the I'll Take You With Me scenario.
It isn't my idea of fun, for the record.
But it IS what Eclavdra would do, if the drow were being crushed.
For that matter, it is what Iuz would do.

And if Iuz and Eclavdra might be willing to do it, others might.

Facing threats from the good and the evil powers, and wondering how to save my power, this awful idea of the Suicide Scenario came to my mind.
And I realized it would not be good for the IR. If I legitimately got 10th level magic, that would be another matter, but this is going to be Turn 1.

So, I posted that I thought the tactic should be prohibited. In so doing, I did in my own power, taking away a supreme deterrent I could have used to keep you all at bay.
But where's the fun?
How fun is it, if I say: If I go, I'll take half the IR down with me? On a fluke caused by the presence of a spell in the Book of Vile Damnation that ... well, the authors of that book did not foresee the circumstances of this IR when they put that spell in there!

I used myself as the example.
But any power, even a good power, could use this deterrent, and if crushed this final answer.
In the Real World, every nuclear power has used this tactic as a deterrent, and is prepared to use the Suicide Scenario if crushed.
It is hard to imagine that people won't use this tactic in the IR.

That is why I am advocating banning it.

Yes, eventually, the powers of the IR will have nuclear weapons and 10th level magic, and that is a part of Serpenteye's game and what he intended. At that point, we will have all sorts of mayhem and mess, and that's good: that's the way it should be.
But Q-Bomb obliteration of entire powers on Turn 1?
I don't think it would be fun.

If Serpenteye allows this tactic, I refuse to use it. For the record.
I'll allow Eclavdra to be killed, and the drow to be destroyed, before I use this tactic. Because I want other people to have fun, not just myself. And being Q Bombed on a fluke is no fun.

Yours Sincerely
Edena_of_Neith