Just Things I've Made

[Apepsnake]

so I finally logged back on to enworld and found beef's post
sowwy

I just dont find time lords to be very creative
I want an actual sentient universe to have unique stuff and not just be carbon(or quantum in this case) copies of the same thing
if I ever start up pathfinder (oooooooooor, maybe, make my own thing for dnd) ill have some real strong and cool stuff, but it wont just be the same template of d1ks posted over and over
really, like planets, I feel that time lords (and their universes) should vary to such a degree as to be barely recognizable as the same thing; different gravitational constants, entirely different laws of physics and fundamental forces, etc

really I feel like I should make an update of sorts to the IH, like a revision with plenty of tweaking and actual limits on how powerful it can get without being boring.
also more science fiction cause that makes sense

I feel like time lords and Kardashev 5+ species would get along very well, if not be the same thing (is quintessence just a fancy technology of sorts?)

 

[Beefermatic]

so I finally logged back on to enworld and found beef's post
sowwy

I just dont find time lords to be very creative
I want an actual sentient universe to have unique stuff and not just be carbon(or quantum in this case) copies of the same thing
if I ever start up pathfinder (oooooooooor, maybe, make my own thing for dnd) ill have some real strong and cool stuff, but it wont just be the same template of d1ks posted over and over
really, like planets, I feel that time lords (and their universes) should vary to such a degree as to be barely recognizable as the same thing; different gravitational constants, entirely different laws of physics and fundamental forces, etc

really I feel like I should make an update of sorts to the IH, like a revision with plenty of tweaking and actual limits on how powerful it can get without being boring.
also more science fiction cause that makes sense

I feel like time lords and Kardashev 5+ species would get along very well, if not be the same thing (is quintessence just a fancy technology of sorts?)

I guess I just fundamentally disagree with the idea that you see them as carbon copies. I mean this is at it's core a playable table top game. It has to be accessible to people to some degree or it's simply a religious musing with some 'statistics' that really don't mean anything.

I think seeing players play out their own idea of what it is to be a 'God' in their mind on paper is beautiful and I love that idea. You say carbon copies but that's what you see, factually when you look at the stars, carbon copies. Stars of greatly different size and mass some black some light some dense but all just stars.

I just think that it would be a shame to miss the forest for the trees or the stars for statistics.

 

[Apepsnake]

I just dont find doing this 2 step program every time I make a time/high lord to actually be good design

1: find another time lord, copy, and paste that somewhere
2: change name, defense, maybe the health, and abilities and you're done

I find that to just be lazy
think of it like this: entire 1-20 campaign, all of the enemies you fight are the same goblin, only with 1 or 2 more health and AC for every level you go up
living nightmare, hence why im moving on to something else

im also pretty sure I could code a python module and program to make time lords endlessly. if you can get a simple program relying on a module to make something, you know the design is bad and thus the product will be bad. an AI could do better, as could an advanced program, but the product wont be as good as what you yourself could make simply out of being too rigid. humans evolved creativity and problem solving literally to be able to get around problems, the same reason a fish and a cow have different muscle structure. If everything is exactly the same, no matter what, it will fail. having each and every time lord be different and unique makes far more sense, even in theoretical physics, than anything else. Take planets for instance. we have found multiple candidates for earth-like planets, yet despite the nitrogen/oxygen atmosphere, abundance of carbon and silicon and H2O, the chances of humans actually being able to live on that planet are still next to none; this is because the chances of two planets being exactly alike are next to none. Venus, Mars and Earth are radically different despite being so close together. I'd say that to the bacteria on the floor in your bathroom and on your skin think that the entire planet is the whole entire universe. and we can compare Planets to Universes, and so we can compare the Stars to Quantum fluctuations; stars are the reason all elements that aren't hydrogen even exist in the first place, and quantum fluctuations were the building blocks of the early universe and pre-universe. really, because elder ones have such undeniable variety compared to time lords, id say that rebuilding time lords to be individuals instead of machines made for a single purpose is really the only viable conclusion.



sorry for the giant wall of text

 

[Beefermatic]

Exactly. This is a game. Not a religious musing... Thing. It can be used as such but is at it's heart either a 3.5/Pathfinder module, a Standalone d20 game or maybe even a 5th ed module with some tweaking but your code python thing... You can certainly do that with 20th lvl characters and sub epic monsters too. This is a usable system for d20 3.5 not finished but a hell of a lot more complete and complex than Deities and Demigods or the Epic Manual.

We all like playing God in campaign. Let's not get playing with a calculator confused with getting anywhere close to the gateway. The best part about DND is you get to have a fictional universe with enough reality in it to make it really interesting, but scientific research is always advancing, and measurements always get more precise. We can't actually ever know to any true degree. Just enjoy the ride.

 

[Apepsnake]

really all i want is something that isnt so lazy. actual effort to make it creative always just makes it better.
yknow what im gonna update it for pathfinder

im gonna yeet myself into a corner of the internet known as archives of nethys now

 

[Beefermatic]

really all i want is something that isnt so lazy. actual effort to make it creative always just makes it better.
yknow what im gonna update it for pathfinder

im gonna yeet myself into a corner of the internet known as archives of nethys now

I mean you're just repeating yourself. It isn't lazy for players. For a DM or gm trying to make a campaign, it doesn't revolve around Time Lords, most the content is within the first 700 levels past Demiurge Stage 3 there is only a handful of things and hobbyists like on this page have made the majority of the content over the span of 10+ years.

You added a lot to the content and I for one appreciate it but why be so dismissive and abnoxious about it?

Lazy? Upper Krust designed the mechanics by hand, literally, and we ended up adding to it and making something cool as . We took a broken system and made it playable and for the people that, actually, played out the whole thing it's awesome. I literally have a current campaign with a small group. We literally played a few nights ago.

So be bitter or dismissive or insulting but your whole approach is flawed and literally just because you can break something doesn't make it unusable or lazy, that's a silly way of looking at it, you can make regular DND stuff too that's broken af, just keep adding stat points lol.

Not sure what you're going for. Either way though good luck, post if you do but please stop taking a dump on the IH system and everyone's work at the same time. It's just so petty and you're ignoring, a lot.

 

[CruxfieldVictor]

I love the progression that IH has underwent since I first discovered it years ago. The whole thing has gone from memey and laughable to a product that is overall, one of a kind. There's really no tangible market for tabletop play on this level, story or mechanics wise but the confines of IH really give the people who serve as outliers a system to work with.

There's all the crazy super high-tier content for the extremists but like you said Beefer, there's hundreds of levels available to satisfy people who aren't as technically minded or simply don't understand the concepts that make up the layers that transcend regular cosmology.

 

[Beefermatic]

Like I could take a Gold Dragon, alter it's str and Dex give it a good reflex save and an explosive breath attack and call it say a Caesium dragon. (actually sounds fun for subepic) make it chaotic Good and live in some extreme environment. Wow a neeew dragon! See what I mean. That's lazy perhaps or that's usable in the context of a campaign when you have a delicate balance. Time and high Lords are routinely destroyed in my campaigns, not via bs, but through mechanical gameplay. There is a way this all works out that Krusty implemented, a peeling of layers of defense, of needing specific keys to break specific systems of defense, of seeing it all come together. Anyway. Hope you change your tune. I thought Bythos was a pretty fun concept. Adds a lot of depth when used correctly.

 

[Beefermatic]

I love the progression that IH has underwent since I first discovered it years ago. The whole thing has gone from memey and laughable to a product that is overall, one of a kind. There's really no tangible market for tabletop play on this level, story or mechanics wise but the confines of IH really give the people who serve as outliers a system to work with.

There's all the crazy super high-tier content for the extremists but like you said Beefer, there's hundreds of levels available to satisfy people who aren't as technically minded or simply don't understand the concepts that make up the layers that transcend regular cosmology.

Pretty much my point exactly. Even past level 1000 you can make a campaign work. I usually have one or two players that want to go allll the freaking way so I placate that. With Nehaschimic and Eschatolic Dragons, Mulahatimic Dragons, Xenopactli, the stuff you added Apep, my Aspects and Guardians and some soap opera level storyline. Man. The sky's the limit. Lol

 

[Beefermatic]

Also it's only lazy and cut and pastey when making npc high and time Lords. Not so much the case when I help take the ugly mess of 6-8 lined papers of written info and a basic Pathfinder Character sheet with all margins utterly filled, and make it legible to some degree. But there are so many items of ultimate power, McGuffin "Deus ex Machina*s, guantlets of Infinite Power, etc that actually making this work is a lot lot different than just me sitting down and making Rei for example by taking my Time Lord and doubling it's stats and hd and adding a Word of Chaos 'fiiiiiiirrree' ability.

It's the same difference as the Caesium dragon example as above. But say you started the campaign as a little baby Caesium dragon worked your butt off for a year or so, maybe much longer if you have a douchebag dm, and had a class on top of it.

Some 38 hd Caesium Dragon Chaos Monk/Rogue combo... give him a giant hammer or a scimitar and some crazy Tarrasque scale armor, that he literally took and made from it's corpse, man... That character would be sick as hell! And anyone would be proud of that character.

Just saying context and difficulty over time.

Levelling up a Time or Demiurge level peep is like making a whole new character. I routinely just keep old character sheets of players when they ascend from Sidereal to Demiurge, many of my Sidereals are literally just old character sheets lol.

I don't mean to be inundating, just saying.