Kyle Brink Interviewed by Teos Abadia (Alphastream) on OGL, WotC, & D&D

D&D executive producer's Kyle Brink's second hour-long interview OGL/D&D has dropped--this one is with Teos Abadia, otherwise known as Alphastream. The notes below are my attempt to paraphrase the main things Brink said, but as always you should watch the actual video if you want the full context. Company Structure There's around 30 people on the D&D team, and that many again freelancers...

D&D executive producer's Kyle Brink's second hour-long interview OGL/D&D has dropped--this one is with Teos Abadia, otherwise known as Alphastream. The notes below are my attempt to paraphrase the main things Brink said, but as always you should watch the actual video if you want the full context.

Company Structure
  • There's around 30 people on the D&D team, and that many again freelancers.​
  • The hiring process has equity targets to bring in a representative sample of candidates, after which it is who is the best candidate.​
  • There has been increasing diversity in the pool of designers while maintaining quality.​
  • Brink reports to Dan Rawson, senior VP of D&D, who reports to Cynthia Williams, president.​
  • D&D Beyond is the front door to D&D on the web and will be even more so. It is the D&D website, and will become more so.​
  • D&D Game Studio is center for game content. D&D Beyond turns that into a play service. Content gets expressed in ways appropriate to an audiance (ie digital, book, etc.)​
OGL/Creative Commons
  • It was a surprise to some of the D&D team that the OGL might be changed. Partly that was about shielding them from distracting stuff. Brink feels that was too strong a wall and their views might have been beneficial.
  • Some internal feedback from the D&D team reflected the views of external creators.
  • The community's point of view was not the one wining internally, but may have been had people there been able to speak more loudly.
  • The worry was about new technologies and big companies--Brink uses the VR example, with user generated content but poor content controls. They didn't want the term D&D to become 'that video porn game' looking ahead.
  • The position now is that the community is the strongest weapon against that.
  • The royalties were to discourage big companies moving in and redefining D&D. By 'drips and drips' they got to the wrong position. $750K was a ceiling which they felt would not affect most creators, and larger companies would deal directly with WotC.
  • Right now they're looking at protecting D&D via things not now in the Creative Commons. Community protects the open space and WotC protects copyright and trademark.
  • They feel that the community is able to take care of hateful content.
  • They want the creator community. A deal where WotC got more powers to act but lost the creator community was not a good deal.
  • NFTs are not the concern, it's about how people use them for scams.
  • WotC will be publishing a content policy (for representation, hateful content, etc.) and hold themselves to it. They cannot hold others to it.
  • The Creative Commons license chosen's lack of sharealike attribution isn't a problem for WotC. They want people to build stuff they own and don't have to share and build value in their own IP. They've chosen the road which gives creators the choice, and can make any of their content sharealike, but WotC isn't forcing them to.
  • CC means that nobody has to take WotC's word for anything as they don't control that license.
  • The drive to change the OGL was coming from various parts of the organization (legal, business, studio). It was an ongoing effort when Brink arrived.
  • The faster the audience grew the bigger the risk that hateful content or scams would arise, so there was a rising sense of urgency to take action.
  • Did anybody sign the v1.1 version? It was distributed with an NDA, and with some creators a discussion about other arrnagements/licenses they might make separate from the OGL.
  • 'The impression someone could get that I have to sign v1.1 is absotely a believable impression for someone to get'.
  • The design of v1.1. was always going to be an ongoing no-signature process.
  • Feedback from larger creators like Kobold Press, the failing is on WotC for not communicating that they were listening. 'Thanks for the feedback' isn't enough.
  • 'If you're going to write a new OGL to protect yourself from the vulnerabilties of the old OGL, you kinda have to take the old OGL off the table, otherwise you're not protecting yourself at all'. There's no point in changing the OGL if you don't de-authorize the old one.
  • They weren't worried about competitors arising from within the community. They love the creator community, and WotC can't satisfy all appetites. That serves the broad needs of the player community.
  • They wanted to have closer relationships with the most successful creators, talking to them about licenses and going bigger. The tiering structure was meant to identify those creators. 'The way it was executed was very cleary going to be an attenuating destructive structure which we did not want.'
  • The OGL survey results were clear, from a range of people, 15000 responses. The intent was to treat it like a playtest but it became obvious where it was going. The survey feedback supported CC, and there was no reason to drag it out.
  • WotC still has their concerns, but their approach to it has changed (to a combo of copyrght/trademark and community).
  • Putting D&D into CC has made de-authing the OGL unimportant to WotC.
  • The SRD will be updated to continue to be compatible with evolving rules.
  • They're looking at adding the 3.5 SRD to the SRD but they have to review that content to make sure they're not accidentally putting stuff into CC.
Company Culture
  • People being afraid to speak up is a sign of 'immature management' and leading from ego.
  • That's not the kind of leaders WotC has today, but Brink cannot speak about those who were there before he arrived.
  • Brink feels that every month he is there people feel more comfortable speaking up, though that doesn't mean they'll always agree. But they will listen.
  • 'That's not how we operate today but I can certainly believe echoes of that in the past'.
VTTs/Digital/DDB
  • Roll20 and Fantasy Grounds are important to the hobby and WotC.
  • WotC is also making digital playspaces. The goal is to give more choice. The way WotC succeeds is if they make the best stuff. It's a 'virtuos' competition.
  • The license that Roll20 etc. has to sell WotC content still applies. Remains to be seen down the road.
  • It's possible that third party content will be seen inside DDB or the VTT but it takes a fair amount of work to being a piece of content in. It would have to be a pretty important piece of third party content. Brink could see a day when that would happen.
One D&D
  • The OGL issue has not impacted the One D&D strategy. It has maybe helped WotC express their plans publicly.
  • D&D should be a living game which evolves but is familiar.
  • The One D&D timeline is not changed, but the playtest timeline was impacted by the OGL situation. They'll get back on track real soon.
  • A professional research team gathers the survey information.
  • There are also internal playtests with robust feedback.
Other
  • The game team has gained more of a voice.
  • More trust has been built between design leadership and the executive team.
  • Dan Rawson's role is new and is the first time the D&D brand has been represented at that level at the executive level.
  • Cynthia Williams is empathetic and data-oriented, and willing to change direction.
  • It sounds like they'd consider the SRD being placed into French, German, Italian, and Spanish, though Brink did not promise.
 

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mamba

Legend
My take on this is: Do wizards really not have a community management team? It appear they sendt business negotiators to present the 1.1. They put an executive producer in front of damage controll. The initial response definitely was written by someone not having the slightest clue about how to manage a community. Kyle is presenting the 30 specialised designers under him as those closest to the community.

That make no sense! If they actually have noone hired to actively engage with the community (as opposed to customer relations which is a very different field), then this kind of idiocy is just bound to happen..
I'd rather hear from him than some PR spokesperson
 

mamba

Legend
Six months ago I would have echoed your concern. However I don’t see how you can look at this year’s releases, which seem both innovative and yet familiar And maintain that position. It smacks of entrenchment.

Phandelver wasn‘t a gimick it’s very solid campaign area building off a working kernel. Keys from the Golden Vault looks really interesting, everything that was missing from Dragonheist. If the rest is dross then I’ll still be very happy with these two.
I am not sure I would call a book about Giants, a larger Phandelver campaign, a return of Plansescape or a book of 'everything' innovative. I guess that leaves the heists, let's hope they are good ;)

That does not mean I might not be interested in some of the non-innovative ones, my objection is to calling them innovative
 

see

Pedantic Grognard
I'm sorry but this still seems like bollocks/spin to me, and I'm sad to see it being repeated.

If they were really worried about "big companies" abusing the OGL, they could have set the threshold at like $10m or $50m or whatever. But they set it basically as low as they thought they could get away with, without causing rioting. Thankfully they were very much mistaken about it not causing rioting.
The idea that the top executives told their minions "Stop Disney", and that as the implementing language was being knocked back and forth between minions in business and legal, the dollar threshold got pulled too far down? That's really not all that improbable. Particularly since when the numbers were set (but before other parts were set) there may well have been someone saying "Look, we've spent too much time on this already, it's not like these numbers are carved in stone, we just need a clear opening position for when we show it to the first parties under NDA".

People declaring that Hasbro was deliberately being maximally evil are, IMO, generally giving Hasbro way too much credit. This whole fiasco is, in fact, adequately explained by the usual levels of ignorance and poor communications that happen inside a large corporation. Let me get my father to tell you some of his stories about working in GM middle management in the 1980s and 1990s . . .
 


ThorinTeague

Creative/Father/Professor
Kyle Brink, as paraphrased by Morrus:

"They didn't want the term D&D to become 'that video [adult content] game' looking ahead."

To state the obvious:

The OGL1.0 always explicitly protected "the term D&D" as Product Identity.

Either Kyle Brink and his supervisors know this, and are cunningly counting on most of the listeners to not know or care;
Or Kyle Brink and his supervisors are astoundingly ignorant of one of the basic foundations of the TRPG ecosystem for the past 23 years.
Either way, these folks (whether they be liars or ignoramuses) are not trustworthy stewards of our game.
I now feel that Kyle is being scapegoated. I think the architects of the ogl debacle are pushing him out to the public in the hopes that he will interface with the community and either get them on board, or get them pissed off and make him a sacrificial lamb.


Meanwhile, the ones actually responsible for This disaster get off scot-free while sitting silent and faceless in their ivory tower. It's my belief that any lies Kyle may have told in these interviews, which I believe I spotted several, were told under orders.

Before these interviews came out I was cautiously optimistic that we were in a good place, but these interviews have done nothing to allay my fears that wizards won't try more or less the same thing again. In fact, I now believe that this is not over at all, and it's because of these interviews.


Definitely take everything I'm saying here with a grain of salt. It's all blithe speculation based on 100% gut hunch in 0% known fact.
 

ThorinTeague

Creative/Father/Professor
The idea that the top executives told their minions "Stop Disney", and that as the implementing language was being knocked back and forth between minions in business and legal, the dollar threshold got pulled too far down? That's really not all that improbable. Particularly since when the numbers were set (but before other parts were set) there may well have been someone saying "Look, we've spent too much time on this already, it's not like these numbers are carved in stone, we just need a clear opening position for when we show it to the first parties under NDA".

People declaring that Hasbro was deliberately being maximally evil are, IMO, generally giving Hasbro way too much credit. This whole fiasco is, in fact, adequately explained by the usual levels of ignorance and poor communications that happen inside a large corporation. Let me get my father to tell you some of his stories about working in GM middle management in the 1980s and 1990s . . .
When the ignorance runs so deep as to be functionally indistinguishable from malice, how should that affect the public response?
 


mamba

Legend
I now feel that Kyle is being scapegoated. I think the architects of the ogl debacle are pushing him out to the public in the hopes that he will interface with the community and either get them on board, or get them pissed off and make him a sacrificial lamb.
I don't know, to me it feels more like he decided to not let whoever was running this first muck it up even further and took the steering wheel away from them. Kudos to him for that.
 
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