Let there be light!

[brehobit]

OK,
We've largely ignored lighting issues to this point for one reason or another, but I wanted to get them right this time around. I'm away from my books as I type this but was darn confused when I last read them.

Say you have a light source that provides 5 squares of bright light (which I think a torch does). What happens at square 6? Darkness? Dimness? What impact does low-light vision have?

Thanks,

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

Darkness. There is no zone of dim light in 4e. Light sources either shed bright light or dim light, not both. The DM can always designate zones of dim light. A few common light sources do shed dim light, like the wizard cantrip and things like a candle. The main ones though are going to shed bright light.

Basically if you want dim light you either have to restrict the players to less effective light sources or just create some. low light vision really has very limited usefulness.

 

[Mengu]

Yeah, by RAW it is either bright light, or dark, with nothing in between.

I find this to be a bit odd. So I handwave a shadowy zone one or two squares in and out from the edge of the bright light. So 5 square bright light (say torch) becomes 4 square bright, 2 square dim. 10 square lantern may become 8 square bright, 4 square dim. I might handwave shadowy corners in a room otherwise lit by ambient light (such as a tavern).

But in practice, lighting hardly ever comes into play for combat except maybe the first round, unless one side is making an effort to use lighting to their advantage (which is very rare).

 

[Saeviomagy]

I still remember a shadowrun battle I ran as a DM where a mixed assault group fought the PCs (who happened to all be able to see in the dark). The entire combat focussed on keeping the lights switched off, making the light switches serious tactical objectives.

I think that a dungeon where the patterns of light and shadow were well outlined would be great, doubly so if you have PCs trained in stealth.

 

[jester_gl]

I had two occasions as a DM where lighting was actually a useful tool.

The PC were escaping from a prison atop a tower and couldn't use torch to light their way otherwise the light could be seen from outside and they really didn't want to attract undue attention. The guards were goblins and other low-light vision humanoid who were standing around dimly lit room with candles on top of barrels and such.

Let me just say that the rogue really liked that dungeon, and the druid began blasting far off corner in every room just to make sure after the first couple lurkers.

The second time was in a huge room in a library in undermountain. The only lighting available in there was provided by the PCs (this time including a wizard) and the enemies (duergar) included a higher level lurker as their boss (fleshtearer). Careful positioning of the wizard's light spell became strategically important.

Lighting is a tool that can be used by the DM to enhance a particular encounter, but that should be handwaved most of the time.

P.S.: Ever seen a movie which had bad lighting from start to end just to hide the bad special effect. Don't cheapen your game like this. Your budget is your imagination. If you are ever too tired to provide a good description of a scene, cast a permanent darkness spell on the area and let the mayhem begin.

 

[Dr_Ruminahui]

My Dming session last weekend, my party is going up a mountain which, in essence, is deep in the Shadowfell and is swarming with undead and lost souls. Basically, just outside of their light radius, the souls wait hungrily, afraid of the light.

The party's main light source is a floating lantern... other than that, the party has torches and the wizard has the light spell, but neither are typically used.

At one point in the battle, the wizard was left outside of the light source, and I had the souls gather into a wraith, which attacked him and then followed him back into the light. It worked very nicely, and I'm sure the party from now on will be very careful of how they move their light, which I hope will make for a very neat "mini game" inside of the future encounters on the way up this mountain.

I think the wizard plans to keep his light cantrip up for the rest of the adventure, if he can.

I've also heard of other cool uses of light sources, such as in a defiled cathedral, where the shadows caused necrotic damage and the light through the windows (and therefore the "safe" zone) shifted throughout the encounter, apparently creating some interesting tactical considerations.

Another thing to try would be the monsters focus firing on the PCs with light sources and then seek to extinguish them if/when a player goes down - if you allow the PCs to figure that out, you could have interesting tactical effect where recovering/relactivating the light source is as important as getting their buddy up.

Perhaps also handy in such encounters is the Shadow slime, who has a power that can extinguish one lightsource until it is relit.

 

[jester_gl]

That shadow slime just reminded me of the Shadow Hound. They have an aura 5 power (Shroud of night) which reduces bright light to dim light and dim light to darkness. A couple of these mixed with other monsters always make for a cool night ambush. The campfire suddenly doesn't provide much light anymore...

 

[Wik]

Last year, my friends I went camping on Cowichan River. Imagine a small river surrounded by hills, all densely packed with old growth forests (read as: trees at least one hundred feet tall).

When the sun went down, it got dark. REAL dark. ABout the only thing you could see were the silhouettes of the trees against a dark purple skyline.

Many of us are D&D nerds, and we discussed the lighting rules in pretty much every version of D&D. So we did some experiments.

Around the central fire, we could see things fairly clearly out to about 15 feet or so (3 squares). Anything 10 feet or so outside of that radius was in "dim" light, and hard to see.

With a flashlight, we could see clearly in a small cone, about 20 feet ahead of us. Everything else was pitch black.

With myt "lantern" LED flashlight, we could see in a 10 foot radius around us - but only if I held the lantern up high, like you see in those old fantasy books. If I held it at my side, or attached it to my belt, then movement could block the light of the lantern and make visibility worse. "Dim" light only extended about another 10 feet. If that.

Then we made a torch - with kerosene and all. It shed about five feet of "bright" light, if you could call it bright. And maybe another 5 of dim light.

Our final conclusion? All of the lighting ranges in D&D are BS. A sunrod illuminating 20 squares is absolute bunk.

 

[Aulirophile]

Sunrods are magical. I agree the candle/torches/etc rule are a bit eh, but you object to Magical light illuminating 20 squares? Just pretend it is an industrial halogen squeezed into rod form.

 

[Wik]

Sunrods are magical. I agree the candle/torches/etc rule are a bit eh, but you object to Magical light illuminating 20 squares? Just pretend it is an industrial halogen squeezed into rod form.

Except, I can't think of anything that illuminates in a 100 foot radius. I've gone camping a lot - nothing, even on the top end of the spectrum (ha! Spectrum!) does even close. Hell, a handheld maglight only illuminates about a 30 or 40 foot cone... and when I had one of those flashed in my face, it actually physically HURT.

Hey, I've gone caving, and even with ten people, all with head-mounted high power flashlights, I would say that only a few "squares" of that cave were "bright" illumination. Most wasn't even "Dim".

Your typical D&D sunrod would burn the retinas of anyone that looked at it. Not to mention that, unless it was on the end of a staff suspended above your head, any PC that got in the way of the light would cast a HUGE shadow.

It's a minor point thrown in for gameplay purposes. But having actually been in very dark situations and seeing what we have in available lighting (it gets pretty dark outdoors in rural BC), and something like sunrods really stand out. Everyone in my group instantly scoffed at it.