D&D 5E Levelling NPCs?

[CapnZapp]

And I'm saying Jimjar is a equal to a level 4 rogue. He'd need as much XP as a level 4 rogue needs to get to level 5 and gets level 5 rogue features or something equivalent (1d8 HD + Uncanny dodge).

Edit: You might not give that third 1d6 sneak attack die though. Jimjar has to wait 2 more levels before I'd give him a third 1d6 die.

Jimjar would still be weaker than a equal level rogue but you can gauge him right.

We're closer than ever before to reaching an understanding of each others' viewpoints, which is great

Now, to further your opinion you'd need to present a procedure for how you end up gauging the Spy as a level 4 Rogue. Preferably one that is simple. Thank you.

Meanwhile, I will remind you that my own proposed procedure isn't meant to be fair to Jimjar. It is mainly (by far) intended to be quick and simple, and as a (distant) second intended to put the spotlight on the characters, while still not going with the (also very reasonable) third possible procedure technically known as "doing nothing" ;-)

To say that as simple as I can: using hit dice as levels is very quick and simple. Using hit dice ensures two things:

1) that PCs get to shine
2) that NPCs have the staying power they need in order not to be porcelain vases the PCs need to actively protect (since when that happens, it is time to have them leave the party)

And with this I sincerely hope you finally see my side of things, Minigiant, just as I now see yours!

 

[CapnZapp]

If you (or anyone else) can find a significant problem resulting from "HD = effective level for levelling purposes", I'm all ears. But "not being fair to the NPC" is, by itself, not enough for me to consider using a more complex scheme.

Instead of being stuck at this initial step, I would much rather proceed to explore the nuances of what my approach leads to. Meaning things like, how to handle special class-like features, such as spellcasting, sneak attack, and more.

As for spellcasting, that looks to be pretty straightforward. 1 HD = 1 level of a spellcasting class.

As for consequences, I agree this makes NPC spellcasters pretty valuable to a PC party.

As for sneak attack, the MM seems to be fairly stingy with that, handing out sneak dice slower than the 1:2 progression for Rogues.

I think I can understand that. Monsters are generally strong on defense but weak on offense (in order for PCs to have time to react to their foes before getting critically low on hp).

The only reasonable progression that I can think of is 1:3, and so that is what I consider using for the Spy. Thoughts on that? Here's the extrapolated naive progression:

Hit Dice Sneak Dice
1
2
3 1d6
4
5
6 2d6 (Spy)
7
8
9 3d6
10
11
12 4d6 (Assassin)
13
14
15 5d6
16
17
18 6d6
...

This actually matches up with the only two MM entries using it, as indicated above.

It generally works for other sources of "extra" damage too such as surprise attack and charge. Sometimes the damage is one die higher than indicated above, but that I'm willing to chalk up to the designer's "artistic freedom".

This specifically means that, if you, like me, are planning on granting Jimjar a third sneak die already at 7 HD, that would probably be completely okay.

 

[Dragonsbane]

I concur with some of the posters, 1HD doesn't equal 1 CR. It seems almost 2HD per 1 CR. Sadly that doesn't match up with NPC levels, it was strange to see a 6th level cleric with 12HD ojo

I do give NPCs a CR however, so I can always on the fly add their proficiency bonus to things like skill checks or saves.