Looking for a motivation for players (do something cool cards?)

[TikkchikFenTikktikk]

The three things that keep combat moving:

1. Make sure players know where they are in the initiative order. Use a tool to track initiative that is visible to the players.
2. As a player is taking his turn, remind the next player that they are "on deck" and should be readying their actions.
3. Run interesting combats:

1. cool monsters that move around and have cool effects
2. banter between monsters and PCs
3. interesting and dynamic terrain
   [*}and monsters that have a strategy, use tactics, and run or surrender instead of fighting to the death (consider using a simple morale system)

Having a firm hand is important. Being a parent helps. Don't be afraid to implement a pseudo-real time system or bring a timer to the table for a few sessions if the problem is really bad. If they run out of time or take "too long" (arbitrarily determined by you) they get dropped to the bottom of the initiative or lose their turn completely.

 

[Goonalan]

I give a +1 To Hit for describing the action, and another +1 to damage if the PCs keep in game RP for the whole of their round and make it sound coolio. I do something similar for Skill Checks.

For slow play I generally let the player know he has 1 minute more (or whatever) and then he gets skipped (I used to just move them down the initiative order), while it sounds heartless and cruel I'm more often than not able to do all actions for all of my bad guys in the time it takes a single player to complete their turn (two players tops), and generally there are more bad guys than players on the map.

I've had problems with slow play in the past but the above has worked for me, when a player misses a turn- which has only happened maybe three or four times in 50+ sessions then... they speed up. I usually point out that a round represents 6 seconds of play, they don't have time to weigh up every option.

With the big dramatic fights I give the PCs five minutes down time to talk tactics, once the fight starts however there's no stopping.

I've tried and rejected the stopwatch method that didn't work for us- some of the players seem to have a much easier time of it- from experience its the Defenders that play quicker than most (as I say just my experience). Anyone with Area/Blast/Burst et al spends an extra 30 secs plus counting squares and looking for the optimum effect.

Cheers Goonalan

 

[Riastlin]

The big thing for me is trying to keep players focused on the game when it isn't their turn. I've seen players who were busy playing with their phones, laptops, etc. during other players turns then don't hear you right away when you announce its their turn. Table talk can also contribute to this -- and is often a symptom of slow play. Ultimately though, some players are just plain going to be slower than others. Your tacticians in particular will take a while (comparitively) since their ultimate fear is making a less than optimal decision given the situation.

Another thing that I have noticed is that the higher up in level you go, the bigger the problem becomes as characters have more options, monsters have more abilities, more immediate actions crop up, etc. Suddenly, you end up spending ten minutes (perhaps a slight exaggeration) resolving the opportunity and immediate actions that result from one player's standard action and then realize its still that first player's turn and now another player thinks he's been skipped since its been almost 20 minutes since he acted, though its still the second round. Addiing to this is the fact that at higher levels its far more likely that the results of one player's turn will greatly impact what the next player wants to do. When this happens, the next player may have had his action already planned out but suddenly that action is no longer particularly desireable so he has to resurvey the field so to speak.

All in all, I think that the first, best thing to do is lead by example. Have your monsters ready to go when its their turn (even if it means occasionally making suboptimal choices). Did you forget that the immobilized monster that's marked by the paladin two squares away has reach? Oh well. Dung happens. If you do this, it makes it easier to apply a simple nudge along the lines of "So what do you do Ted?" I usually go this route and it almost always results in a quick decision. If not, I'll ask a second time and then they'll go. Most players should understand at that point that they are holding up the game and will make a decision then.

To me, the biggest incentive for players is simply time and XP. My homebrew game takes place at an FLGS so we are on a strict time scale every session as another group comes in after us. The faster the players go, the more encounters they get. The more encounters they get, the more XP and treasure they get. Ultimately, that is its own reward. Our last session went really well in terms of speed and everyone was remarking at how great it was that we were really moving. With luck, they'll hit Paragon at the end of next session.

 

[shadzar]

I'm a fan of positive reinforcement; give them a +1 for being ready. They can use it on any one die roll that turn.

Best idea ever. Glad I read this before replying cause it sure beats mine.

My method for whoever is concerned is a 20 seconds rule and an egg timer. You have 3 minutes to finish your turn if needed due to strange things that may need looking up or decided on from your actions. The next player has that time plus 20 seconds when their turn arrives to do something. The 3 minutes do not roll over from player to player, so each player has the full round plus the previous players turn and then 20 seconds to do something, or they were just struggling wit what they didnt last turn or fumbling with what they tried to do this turn and got left behind. I will stick to me negative reinforcement though. I don't feel doing the job right deserves special treatment or recogniztion. Only doing the job above and beyond should get special rewards.

 

[sunrisekid]

I'm a fan of positive reinforcement; give them a +1 for being ready. They can use it on any one die roll that turn.

I second this, will definitely be trying this out during future sessions. Thanks for the great suggestion

 

[Rune]

My system is simple and speeds things up two-fold.

When I say, "It's your turn. Are you ready?" If the answer is yes, the player takes a +1 token. These tokens are cumulative (that is, a player could spend three at once for +3 to something, for instance) and can be used at any time to grant +1 to anything, but they are discarded if unspent by the end of the encounter.

Not only does this provide incentive to be ready, it often shortens the combat a little (turning a missed daily into a hit--or a hit into a crit, for instance).

 

[moxcamel]

I haven't given rewards for being ready a lot of thought, but I'm a big fan of teamwork. I think I'd do any reward on a group basis. Set a time limit for the entire turn, and if the group as a whole beat the clock then they'd be eligible for the carrot.

Seems to me that if you do it with the whole group, then everyone is paying attention the whole time, and helping out if whoever's turn it is needs a little help or prodding.

 

[Saeviomagy]

1. cool monsters that move around and have cool effects
2. banter between monsters and PCs
3. interesting and dynamic terrain
   [*}and monsters that have a strategy, use tactics, and run or surrender instead of fighting to the death (consider using a simple morale system)

Unfortunately in my experience these have made combats run longer and not shorter: the more dynamic a battlefield is, the less likely it is that you can come up with a good plan of action before your go: you'll think up some tactics and the the terrain moves and the monsters scramble the battlefield, and then it's your go and you've got nothing.

 

[Shadowslayer]

Well thanks very much for the replies gents. You've given me some neat ideas and definitely food for thought. The idea of tokens to add a +1 to any roll kind of reminds me of the old hero point system we used to play with back in 1/2e.

There is always: take your turn now or get skipped. Not that I have quite gone there yet either...but worth thinking about.

Little too heavy handed for my tastes. I'm just trying to keep it moving AND make it more fun for the guys.

And also: As the DM, have your stuff together, both to save time and set an example. Again, something I am working on.

Absolutely. I'd never ask them to do something I don't do myself.

My advice is, ask all the players how they feel about how long turns take. If everyone agrees that they are taking too long, have everyone agree to follow some guidelines (be ready on your turn, figure out line of sight questions while it isn't your turn, etc). For me, the key was not to make it a question of me chastising or rewarding players, but everyone agreeing they'd like things to be faster and everyone thinking up ways to make that happen.

Thats true and I should do that. I'm just already seeing signs of obvious boredom.

Part of the reason is we do a lot of combat. Initially it was because these guys REALLY like combat....and my problem is I used it for a crutch. Its been a long time since I DMed and my RP-fu is weak. I think that now the guys are ready for some other stuff to break things up. (they haven't said so, but the signs are there.) I'm looking more into skill challenges and a lot more RP to break it up. Although skill challenges intimidate me for some reason.

I'm a fan of positive reinforcement; give them a +1 for being ready. They can use it on any one die roll that turn.

I'd advise against action points, those already bog the game down somewhat since using one often invokes an entire second decision-making cycle.

Fair enough...that sounds simple.

Do the more storyteller players agonize on how to be creative because combats feel like drudgery?

Has a less experienced player chosen a particularly complicated build?

Does one of the players fear messing up tactics after getting browbeaten by other players for a bad choice? Maybe everyone trying to "help" during their turn confuses them?

Is an old time gamer not familiar with your rules set and having trouble grasping key concepts?

Do you have a player with a mental disability or bad memory? Or maybe they have a stressful job and are frazzled on game night?

None of the above. Just seems to be a lot of waffling at the table. Guys saying "no no no....do this instead" ....even when the initial action was perfectly acceptable.

Hell, just give them a candy if they're ready to go!

Lol....and keep a squirt bottle filled with water for when they're not.

As for the 'Do something Cool' card. Its something seperate that a few DMs on the boards have added to their game to inspire players to think outside of the box.

I do it this way: Its an encounter power that players can use to alter any of their powers in ways that make senseand are fun and cool, or to interact with the terrain or the situation in special, cool fun, awesome ways. They still have to succeed by meeting the requirements I set for them. However even if they fail, their action has some relevant, positive side effect (my discretion).

Its another awesome element I would recommendadding to your game.

Is there some other resource out in internet land that expands on this a little better? As I said, I seem to remember someone posting about this in detail. Might have been Piratecat, but I'm not sure.

 

[jbear]

I definitely stole it from Pirate Cat. There is definitely a link floating around that talks specifically about this. I'll see if I can find it.