magic missile always hits again???

[Kerranin]

Would you rather have $20, or have a 50% chance of getting $40?

Isn't it more like $10 or a 50% chance of $40 dollars and a 5% chance of $100?

 

[Jhaelen]

The psychology is interesting.

By the math and numbers, it isn't even a very good power.

By the feel of the thing, it's a power that people want, that people get, and that people find uses for.

All because it eliminates uncertainty. You are no longer at the whims of chance and luck. You have this effect, and no one can take it away from you.

Yup. The wizard player in my group was very excited about the change and it's easily his favorite power now.
Whenever he's out of range or cannot see his target, it's magic missile time.
Whenever it looks like an enemy will go down after one more hit, it's magic missile time.
Whenever his allies would be in danger of getting hit by an area attack power, it's magic missile time.
Whenever he cannot think of anything better to do, it's magic missile time.

He asked our journal-keeper to note down every time he 'fragged' an enemy, and it really was an amazingly large number. Before the change to magic missile his favorite at-will attack power was Thunderwave, so it really was a huge change to the way he played before.

 

[Obryn]

The psychology is interesting.

By the math and numbers, it isn't even a very good power.

I'd argue that it depends on the situation, the math, and the numbers. 8 automatic damage is better than a 50% chance at an average of 13.5 damage.

-O

 

[I'm A Banana]

I'd argue that it depends on the situation, the math, and the numbers. 8 automatic damage is better than a 50% chance at an average of 13.5 damage.

Right. It's just that normally, the autodamage isn't as effective as a solid chance of higher damage (usually the chance to hit is more like 65, though higher-level monsters or high-defense monsters can affect that).

But it's always a very mentally satisfying spell. Because it never misses. Even if that's not that big of a mechanical advantage, it's a HUGE psychological boost.

Which makes the game design of it interesting. In a way, turning MM into auto-hit is WotC somewhat realizing that mechanics by themselves aren't always sexy. A little reason to say "Cool!" goes far.

 

[renau1g]

Isn't it more like $10 or a 50% chance of $40 dollars and a 5% chance of $100?

Should be either a higher % for that 100 or a higher $ amount than 100.

The Expected value is $10, $20, & $5 currently, it should be either 25% chance at $100 to allow those with high risk tolerance a better result, or 5% of $500, which is $25 EV.

 

[Delgar]

Okay stupid question time.

If someone has a power that add's extra damage to force effects. Such as a superior implement. Does this extra damage not get added to this power because it has no damage roll?

 

[Pbartender]

Okay stupid question time.

If someone has a power that add's extra damage to force effects. Such as a superior implement. Does this extra damage not get added to this power because it has no damage roll?

If the power specifies "damage roll", then yes, you are correct.

Force Wands, for example state "Gain a +2 item bonus to damage rolls when you use this wand to attack with a power that has the force keyword." That bonus would not apply to Magic Missile, since you do not roll for damage.

 

[Sunseeker]

If the power specifies "damage roll", then yes, you are correct.

Force Wands, for example state "Gain a +2 item bonus to damage rolls when you use this wand to attack with a power that has the force keyword." That bonus would not apply to Magic Missile, since you do not roll for damage.

Exactly, yes. Though I would make sure to check any errata on the item in question, just to be sure something hasn't changed.(assuming you're using the latest errata at all!)

 

[ShadesOfGrey]

Now, magic missile really does scale badly as far as damage goes and doesnt include tactical or strategic value other then a few points of damage.

However, that balances out with the fact that it *always* hits, for a set amount of dammage and is an at-will power available automaticly available at 1st level, no feat or or other power required.

The ability to reliably always be able to just point at an enemy and do a *know* amount of damage beforehand is a powerful one.
It chews up minnions, and I can think of a couple of situations where a small amount of assured damage is a tempting option over more damage / effect but a significant chance of failure.

It's basicaly a fallback weapon, but certainly not the worst kind of fall backweapon you could have.

 

[Pbartender]

Now, magic missile really does scale badly as far as damage goes and doesnt include tactical or strategic value other then a few points of damage.

However, that balances out with the fact that it *always* hits, for a set amount of dammage and is an at-will power available automaticly available at 1st level, no feat or or other power required.

The ability to reliably always be able to just point at an enemy and do a *know* amount of damage beforehand is a powerful one.
It chews up minnions, and I can think of a couple of situations where a small amount of assured damage is a tempting option over more damage / effect but a significant chance of failure.

It's basicaly a fallback weapon, but certainly not the worst kind of fall backweapon you could have.

Forgive me for a minor digression...

One house rule our group will be trying out soon is to remove the scaling damage from Magic Missile -- it would always stay at Int + 2. Instead, at Paragon levels it changes to a Move action to cast, and at Epic levels it is changes to a Minor action.

It allows for more targets and better damage scaling over all, but at the expense of requiring more actions in a single round to gain those benefits. It also allows Magic Missile to be used as an end of the round damage kicker... Allowing the Wizard to burn any extra move or minor actions for the round on dealing a bit of damage to an enemy or two.

I'm looking forward to seeing how well it works.