Make It Yourself

[Yora]

Not if it's quality over quantity.
Most people are really just interested in more good and interesting stuff. Not just more stuff.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Not if it's quality over quantity.
Most people are really just interested in more good and interesting stuff. Not just more stuff.

They're also very interested in more powerful stuff, particularly if they play rather than DM.

 

[Yora]

Yes, but those people have no taste.

 

[Tony Vargas]

I didn't mean to imply that either. I was speaking of a particular small yet vocal subset of folks who seem incapable of either finding or creating solutions to their particular TTRPG issues.

Like Snarf mentioned, not every complaint is an invitation to find personal solutions, some are 'grievances,' some issues just call for systemic solutions.

I kinda feel less creative output, regardless of why, is a bad thing.

There's less output from WotC, too. Maybe it's a symptom of a 50yo hobby? so much has already been churned out?

They're also very interested in more powerful stuff, particularly if they play rather than DM.

That doesn't strike me as a new thing, at all. Remember the Complete Book of Elves? Oh, or the Necronomican?

 

[Micah Sweet]

Like Snarf mentioned, not every complaint is an invitation to find personal solutions, some are 'grievances,' some issues just call for systemic solutions.


There's less output from WotC, too. Maybe it's a symptom of a 50yo hobby? so much has already been churned out?

That doesn't strike me as a new thing, at all. Remember the Complete Book of Elves? Oh, or the Necronomican?

That's on WotC. I think there's plenty of creative 3pp and homebrew out there. It's just that there are some loud folks who insist on WotC solving all their problems, and beyond venting I see no point to that.

And I never said players wanting more power was a new thing.

 

[Thomas Shey]

Seriously, I do not see why people don't just use a 3pp warlord, or make their own if they feel so strongly about it. Make a case to your GM if you have to.

Its not like people haven't explained in this thread why this looks good on paper but in many cases in the field ranges from hard to impossible, usually because of networking issues.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Its not like people haven't explained in this thread why this looks good on paper but in many cases in the field ranges from hard to impossible, usually because of networking issues.

Better than shouting into the WotC wind.

 

[Thomas Shey]

None taken, I know I'm old.
The idea that the game should actually provide options, not just be home-brewed into acceptability does go back to 3e, when RaW and 'Player Entitlement' became things, but it hasn't exactly gone away.

The idea of fixing up your D&D, rather than expecting TSR to do it for you, goes all the way back, heck, the D&D ball got rolling when Arneson fixed up Chainmail. We didn't have so many or so complete or such professionally produced games back in the day, so we sought out or/and created all sorts of variants.

That doesn't make us better than WotC era fans who got more, and may want (or want back) still more.

Of course its easy to forget that back when a lot of this was done, there was also far less desire (or practical capability) to make things like new classes actually balanced with extent ones because OD&D didn't really have anything resembling balance, and there were enough random 3PP items in the wild that you weren't liable to be doing worse than they were.

(I realize some people are looking at the word "balance" in the context of talking about 5e and laughing, but there's at least some premise in most cases that that's going on).

 

[Thomas Shey]

I must be old and tired grumpy guy now, but I cannot connect with people complaining how a game is awful for their tastes, but insists in play that same game. No game shall be fun for everyone and it is ok. The games and tone I like can be the same games and tone some people consider awful, and vice versa, and it is ok. However, if you think a game is terrible, why insisting in play it? Certainly there is games more appropriate to your tastes.

Usually because they can't find anyone to play anything else with.

 

[Thomas Shey]

Better than shouting into the WotC wind.

"In practice impossible" is not actually better to most people than "Of little value but at least slightly emotionally satisfying."