Mearls Monster Makeover: Beholder

[Plane Sailing]

Has anyone ever designed a Prismatic Beholder yet?

Seven eyestalks, each firing a ray of the appropriate colour, and having the appropriate effect according to the prismatic ray spell.

To make it more interesting, the Prismatic Beholder can use each eye stalk either offensively or defensively (see the prismatic sphere spell for information about what each stalk can do or protect against).

In addition, it can use a full round action to weave its eyebeams together to make a prismatic wall.

It seems that could be a nifty concept monster. Has anyone seen it done before?

If not, I hereby claim the Prismatic Beholder as my own creation!

 

[blargney the second]

I would *love* to see the prismatic beholder done up. Green Ronin had an Eye Tyrant template that might be a decent starting place.

 

[Fishbone]

Prismatic Beholder? That sounds awesome! What CR would you shoot for with something like that?

 

[babomb]

Has anyone ever designed a Prismatic Beholder yet?

You win the thread.

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

This makeover is poop (though, admittedly, not as bad as the rust monster makeover).

1. Mearls has a problem with facing, since it is an exception for the Beholder, so he eliminates it ... but introduces a new ability that is an exception to the rule anyway? That's logical and consistent. Not.

2. He claims there are five save-or-die effects. Explain to me how charm monster, fear, and sleep are save-or-die effects? Particularly when charm monster is but charm person isn't? It's not like it is dominate monster, which is much more dangerous. And if charm person isn't going to affect a character, sleep isn't going to, either. Flesh-to-stone is only a temporary SoD -- the real ones are disintegrate (which he keeps), and finger of death -- which is still a spell for PCs. At a save DC of 17, those save-or-die effects are just dangerous enough to scare characters of an appropriate level to face a beholder while having a relatively low probability of success.

3. He forgets about the weapon uses for telekinesis, though the throw effect is an OK substitute. As is the "blast ray" (though it needs a better name). Two positives.

4. I hate the nerf of the antimagic cone. Disrupt spellcasting gives one effect -- but the anti-magic cone is so much more interesting. It suppresses melee and missile characters -- the sword stop flaming, the oathbow stops working -- and more importantly stops ongoing spell effects. Nothing says "fear" like the stoneskin dropping, the flying fighter falling to the floor, and the cleric's continual flame mace going out and leaving the party in the dark. Want to stop it from interfering with itself? Make the eye rays Su abilities, and they can't be aimed more than three at a single target. Deal with the facing for the cone -- it ain't that hard, guys. And if it still really bugs you, make it an instantaneous cone whose effects have a 1d4 round duration.

Personally, I'd ditch charm person (redundant to charm monster), sleep, and inflict for something more interesting and CR-appropriate, but otherwise keep the critter pretty much as is.

Now a prismatic beholder, on the other hand, is really a cool idea. I try to color-code beholders rays for specific effects, but that's s great idea!

 

[ThirdWizard]

I'd rip out the beholder page and put this in if there weren't something on the page's other side.

I really don't understand the people who don't like it. It's so much better.

 

[MojoGM]

I'd rip out the beholder page and put this in if there weren't something on the page's other side.

I really don't understand the people who don't like it. It's so much better.

I gotta agree. Not perfect, perhaps, but a major step in the right direction.

What's wrong with making combat easier to adjudicate? Why is every attempt to do so seen as a "miniature induced" threat to "real" RPGs?

This one I'm gonna use, with a little tweaking of course...

 

[Wrathamon]

I agree with the removing of the facing rules of the beholder... and I agree save or die spells arent fun for most DMs or Players. - most games we run we have some sort of 1 game re-roll or similiar "out" for the dreaded "1" on a save.

I think a limit on the number of eye stalks that can target a creature is fair and a better and easier rule to use than facing.

I dont really agree with much else.

Charm, petrification, antimagic and disintegration are all trademarks of the floating ball of eyes and teeth.

What is the point of Charm Person when you have Charm monster which isnt limited to type?

Remove the Charm Person - Keep Charm Monster. This isnt a save or die and there is viable tactics for the players to use and there is a save if it is something the player wouldnt do.
I also allow for multiple saves over time for the player's to "break free" similar to hold person but it isnt every round.

Disintegrate isnt save or die anymore it just does a butt load of damage if you fail the save. It is also a trademark. keep.

Fear - I see nothing wrong with this.

Finger of death - I agree remove it and replace it with the Beholder's version of the Warlock's Eldritch Blast.

Flesh to Stone - I agree that the save or be stone effect is lame. It should do Dex damage. When a Target reaches 0 Dex they are turned to Stone. This gives them a chance to do something. Fort save for Half damage and the player shrugs off the effects. This could be linked with the Slow ray.

Inflict Moderate - Remove and use the Beholder's version of the Warlock's Eldritch Blast.

Sleep - I agree this one is silly - but it is easy to wake someone up. It isnt save or die, but if the beholder has minions it is easy to set up a cue da grace. I can see this getting removed.

SLow - awesome ability - stays and could be linked to a cumulative effect for the flesh to stone.

Telekinesis - not sure what the issue was with this one. i have never had much trouble with it in play.

Antimagic Cone - I dont like the change. Yes, Antimagic fields are a pain and a headache, but this only affects casters. Where before it was a tradeoff for the beholder. Remove all magic and make them try to fight you with normal attacks or blast em with your eye rays.
It also made the warriors and rogues worried and wasnt strictly an anti caster ability.

Also, it removes some of the fun tactics that even published adventures have used. Levitation chamber where the levitation is remove when the beholder turns on the eye.

I havent thought about it enough to give a good alternative, I agree that antimagic fields are a problematic rule.

A targeted dispel effect would be a good replacement eye ray thou for one of the eye stalks.

Not sure about the barrage... why add a dual Initiative ability? Initiative is already a pain in the butt for some people... why make it more confusing for some players?

Dont like this ability, but I think the spirit is interesting.

I like the idea of simplifying the beholder down to 5 Eye effects and 10 stalks. It is simplifying the beast to a more manageable level but not sure the choices of what stayed was right.

I will have to compare the two in actual play.

I dont Hate this one like I hated the rust monster... the ogre magi I dont really recall what it was about... I will have to go read that one again. Ogre magi were weird anyways and I never used them so I dont think I am missing anything.

 

[Remathilis]

Has anyone ever designed a Prismatic Beholder yet?

Hmmm.... Well, it'd look a little something like this....

Prismatic Eye. Each round the prismatic beholder can fire his eyestalks as a standard action. No more than three of these eyestalks can be against any single target. To determine the effects of a given ray, consult the following chart:
1 Red 20 points fire damage (Reflex half)
2 Orange 40 points acid damage (Reflex half)
3 Yellow 80 points electricity damage (Reflex half)
4 Green Poison (Kills; Fortitude partial, take 1d6 points of Con damage instead)
5 Blue Turned to stone (Fortitude negates)
6 Indigo Insane, as insanity spell (Will negates)
7 Violet Sent to another plane (Will negates)
8 Reroll

Prismatic Defense: As a full-round action, a prismatic beholder can use all of his eyestalks to generate a prismatic wall. This acts as spell, save the duration is concentration. If a layer of the prismatic wall is dispelled, the prismatic beholder can use that color ray again. He cannot create another prismatic wall until all the layers are removed.

 

[Greg K]

Flesh to Stone - I agree that the save or be stone effect is lame. It should do Dex damage. When a Target reaches 0 Dex they are turned to Stone. This gives them a chance to do something. Fort save for Half damage and the player shrugs off the effects. This could be linked with the Slow ray.

To each their own. I have no real problem with the idea that my character might be turned to stone or die from a bad save. Perhaps, this is why I find nerfing flesh to stone to be lame.