5E Melee sorcerer build

Looking for advise on how to focus melee on my sorcerer. Currently 5 hexblade and 8 dragon soul. Main play is to cast elemental weapon on sword to get CHA to damage twice. But still kinda feel like it's better to just blast my way through everything. Thoughts?
 

Salthorae

Imperial Mountain Dew Taster
Are you pact of the blade? What Invocations do you have? Are you sword & board or two handed weapons? Are you using feats in your game or not?

How does elemental weapon give you CHA to damage twice? When I read it it says you get +1 to attack/damage and +1d4 elemental damage of your choice.

Personally for my concentration spell I'd stick with the tried and true Hex and Improved Pact weapon to get a +1 weapon that could also be a longbow that uses CHA for hit/dam. Who needs eldritch blast anyway? :p

I like the tough feat for melee casters types, keeps them on their feet a bit better.

Other things... depend on some of the questions above.
 

Zardnaar

Hero
Assuming you have 2 attacks a round.

You can pick up green flame blade and quicken it. Sacrifice spell slots to quicken gfb, use Eldritch blast at range.

You could also hard cast haste to get a 3rd attack. I think you can cast haste, have an attack, then quicken a cantrip.

If you had divine soul instead of dragon adding Spiritual weapon and spiritual guardians.

A while ago.

 

Salthorae

Imperial Mountain Dew Taster
I think you can cast haste, have an attack, then quicken a cantrip.
You could do that. Your quickened cantrip could be GFB or Booming blade as well for an additional attack. Sorcery points are the limiting factor on the quickens.

Either way, Haste is a great idea. As long as you have sorcery points you could make 4 attacks in a round (Attack, Extra attack, Haste Attack, quickened BB or GFB attack).

Hell, if you have Haste up and running for 3 attacks per round and you have Agonizing blast, you can then drop a quickened Eldritch Blast for essentially another 3 attacks in that same round.

If the target is subject to your Hex curse, you'd be dealing a potential metric ton of damage to a single target.

Mutliclass to fighter to pickup Action Surge and get another set of Extra attacks on the target as well.

In a full nova round you could get 5 attacks + 3 EB bolts each dealing Cha+Proficiency+damage dice to a target.

It's not the peak of melee potential, but it's good for sure. Burn another invocation on Eldritch Smite and then you can really maximize those spell slots and crits for damage when they roll around.
 

Zardnaar

Hero
You could do that. Your quickened cantrip could be GFB or Booming blade as well for an additional attack. Sorcery points are the limiting factor on the quickens.

Either way, Haste is a great idea. As long as you have sorcery points you could make 4 attacks in a round (Attack, Extra attack, Haste Attack, quickened BB or GFB attack).

Hell, if you have Haste up and running for 3 attacks per round and you have Agonizing blast, you can then drop a quickened Eldritch Blast for essentially another 3 attacks in that same round.

If the target is subject to your Hex curse, you'd be dealing a potential metric ton of damage to a single target.

Mutliclass to fighter to pickup Action Surge and get another set of Extra attacks on the target as well.

In a full nova round you could get 5 attacks + 3 EB bolts each dealing Cha+Proficiency+damage dice to a target.

It's not the peak of melee potential, but it's good for sure. Burn another invocation on Eldritch Smite and then you can really maximize those spell slots and crits for damage when they roll around.
Hmmn yeah that good. Quicken EB at range 3 attacks, wade in 3 attacks.

Sacrificing spell slots gives more sorcery points.
 

Ashrym

Hero
You could also hard cast haste to get a 3rd attack. I think you can cast haste, have an attack, then quicken a cantrip.
You could do that. Your quickened cantrip could be GFB or Booming blade as well for an additional attack. Sorcery points are the limiting factor on the quickens.
Quickening a cantrip means the only other spell the character can cast is another cantrip with a casting time of 1 action. Casting haste with the regular action prevents casting a quickened cantrip (or any other bonus action spell) because of the cantrips only rule. The character would need to quicken haste as the bonus action and use the regular action to cast the cantrip.

There's a definite rule that might mess up the plan if a person isn't careful with quicken.

Player's Handbook said:
Bonus Action
A spell cast with a bonus action is especially swift. You must use a bonus action on your turn to cast the spell, provided that you haven’t already taken a bonus action this turn. You can’t cast another spell during the same turn, except for a cantrip with a casting time of 1 action.
Using quicken on any spell creates that restriction.

The restriction also means a character cannot cast reaction spells on that turn as well, such as counterspelling a counterspell.
 

Salthorae

Imperial Mountain Dew Taster
The character would need to quicken haste as the bonus action and use the regular action to cast the cantrip.
Ok, so order of operator error, sure.

But it can still be done, you just have to quicken the haste rather than eldritch blast.

And on subsequent rounds, you can Extra Attack, Haste Attack, and quicken an EB for 6 attacks in a round.
 

Ashrym

Hero
Ok, so order of operator error, sure.

But it can still be done, you just have to quicken the haste rather than eldritch blast.

And on subsequent rounds, you can Extra Attack, Haste Attack, and quicken an EB for 6 attacks in a round.
Yeah that example can definitely be done by adjusting the approach. The advice is to watch out for that possible issue when it comes to quicken.
 

Ashrym

Hero
I'll add that the restriction applies to things like healing word as well and people don't always remember that cast the spell means either a standard weapon attack or a cantrip at that point, or on the round spiritual weapon is cast.

It seems like one of those easy-to-forget or overlook rules.
 

Todd Roybark

Explorer
Personally for my concentration spell I'd stick with the tried and true Hex and Improved Pact weapon to get a +1 weapon that could also be a longbow that uses CHA for hit/dam. Who needs eldritch blast anyway? :p
Agree with almost everything except the part about Eldritch Blast..... casting EB thru the Pact Weapon bow is like the bow from the Dungeons and Dragon Cartoon.....Hank wasn’t a Ranger in 5e 😜

The Quadratic Fighter factor from having the multiple EB per round plus CHA bonus Via AB invo plus Hex is going to typically out damage the melee option.

Agonizing Blast (for dmg output) and Repelling Blast for Control are solid options..but less melee themed. Booming Blade combined with the stack-ability of Repelling Blast is a strong battlefield control option....combine with a free Disengage action from Haste and you are a worthy skirmisher.

Shadow of Moil (4th level Warlock spell ) is a very good option.

The Warcaster feat is useful. Improved Pact weapon already supersedes the casting spells with hands full bit of the feat, but the rest is great....advantage on Concentration is fantastic, but Booming Blade as an opportunity attack can wreck someone’s turn.

The Arcane Trickster in my group often will have Greater Invis from the Bard, Sneak Attack/ Booming Blade as their action and then reposition for a Sneak Attack/Booming Blade as an Opportunity Attack if the target moves.

The DMG and Control can really add a wrinkle to an encounter. Are you the primary tank or bonus Melee fighter?
 

Seramus

Adventurer
I'll add that the restriction applies to things like healing word as well and people don't always remember that cast the spell means either a standard weapon attack or a cantrip at that point, or on the round spiritual weapon is cast.

It seems like one of those easy-to-forget or overlook rules.
It's a rule that needs to go away. Either let multiple spells be cast per round if you have the appropriate actions available OR only allow a single spell be cast per round, period. The current rule just causes headaches and confusion at tables.
 

Ashrym

Hero
It's a rule that needs to go away. Either let multiple spells be cast per round if you have the appropriate actions available OR only allow a single spell be cast per round, period. The current rule just causes headaches and confusion at tables.
I give you all the authority that I possess to let you do that at your table. The easiest way to do that is simply ban any spell or ability that grants a spell as a bonus action. The game will still work with a house rule like that.

I'll continue with it, however, because I don't find it an issue after getting into the habit of remembering the rule.

I like having quicken as an option for sorcs (and that bit of action economy capability for other spells / classes) and I like having restrictions on magic to help keep the abuse at a lower limit.
 

Todd Roybark

Explorer
The easiest way to do that is simply ban any spell or ability that grants a spell as a bonus action.
cough it kinda hoses Paladins ( a bit), and Healing Word and Hunters Mark. Hex is a little to good as a bonus action, and still better than Witchbolt even at the cost of a full action.

By RAW one can always cast 2 Cantrips in a round, so based off the OP’s Char level, that is still 6 attacks plus whatever invocation goodness you would like to add.

Get a pair of the poorly named “Illusionist Bracers” from Ravinica, and one does not even need Quicken Metamagic to cast EB twice.
 

Ashrym

Hero
cough it kinda hoses Paladins ( a bit), and Healing Word and Hunters Mark. Hex is a little to good as a bonus action, and still better than Witchbolt even at the cost of a full action.

By RAW one can always cast 2 Cantrips in a round, so based off the OP’s Char level, that is still 6 attacks plus whatever invocation goodness you would like to add.

Get a pair of the poorly named “Illusionist Bracers” from Ravinica, and one does not even need Quicken Metamagic to cast EB twice.
Taking away bonus action spells just means different spells would take their place. It also takes away the primary draw of the sorlocks and sorcadins.

Personally, I'm more inclined to just go with GFB for melee on a melee sorc. Keep it simple.
 

Todd Roybark

Explorer
Keep it simple.
😂, such words in a thread about optimizing a Magnificent Multi-class melee sorcerer.

Say Magnificent Multi-class melee sorcerer once, and ‘Simple’ has already left the building with Elvis. ( Now try saying it 5 times fast 👌)

Besides at 8 cantrips minimum, take EB, GFB, and BB.
 

Ashrym

Hero
Looking for advise on how to focus melee on my sorcerer. Currently 5 hexblade and 8 dragon soul. Main play is to cast elemental weapon on sword to get CHA to damage twice. But still kinda feel like it's better to just blast my way through everything. Thoughts?
Elemental weapon shouldn't give CHA to damage. It gives the weapon +1 to attack and +1d4 of a damage type. If you are tying up your concentration with elemental weapon then you might be better off with hex more of the time. Elemental weapon can be useful but the benefits over hex are situational.

Greenflame blade was mentioned because it's a cantrip that grants your character a melee attack plus bonus damage. Lifedrinker would give you CHA damage a second time but the level requirement is Warlock levels so you don't qualify for that yet, and I didn't notice if you had gone blade pact or not. I am assuming you are.

If you are using thirsting blade then advice like greenflame blade and eldritch blast get a bit marginalized unless you give up using thirsting blade at those times. GFB assumes not using the attack action and using quicken to cast it twice.

The benefit of going for a weapon build on a warlock like this tends to be more about adding a feat to make the weapon attacks worthwhile compared to agonizing blast. Great weapon master and / or pole arm master if you can fit them in makes the melee worth while. My preference is pole arm master but that quicken competition if you are using it. Getting as many attacks as possible is the way to take advantage of your damage bonuses.

Hope that helps.

EDIT: If you are not using thirsting blade then GWM is better so that you can use your bonus action on quickened cantrips.
 
Are you pact of the blade? What Invocations do you have? Are you sword & board or two handed weapons? Are you using feats in your game or not?

How does elemental weapon give you CHA to damage twice? When I read it it says you get +1 to attack/damage and +1d4 elemental damage of your choice.

Personally for my concentration spell I'd stick with the tried and true Hex and Improved Pact weapon to get a +1 weapon that could also be a longbow that uses CHA for hit/dam. Who needs eldritch blast anyway? :p

I like the tough feat for melee casters types, keeps them on their feet a bit better.

Other things... depend on some of the questions above.
Pact of the Blade. Thirsty blade, Tomb of Levistus, and Devil Sight. Dragon sorcerer allows me to add my CHA to elemental weapon as long as it is of the same damage type as my draconic type. Using a one handed sword currently and feats are allowed in the game.
 
Looking for advise on how to focus melee on my sorcerer. Currently 5 hexblade and 8 dragon soul. Main play is to cast elemental weapon on sword to get CHA to damage twice. But still kinda feel like it's better to just blast my way through everything. Thoughts?
Should clarrify, CHA to elemental weapon is because of dragon soul sorcerer. As long as the types match up I am able to gain the bonus to damage. Feats. are allowed in game.
 

Zardnaar

Hero
Main reason for this type of build is versatility. Can't get near someone to hit them? Eldritch Blast.

Quickened EBs have been known about since 2014 or so.

Sentinel feat frees up the bonus action and doesn't suck.
 

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