Microlite20 : the smallest thing in gaming

[MeepoDM]

I see that my buddy Meepo has been holding out a beautiful gem from me.

IMO, this in one of the best implimentations of the open gaming license yet, along with OSRIC and BFRPG.

Eek! Admit that I can see some good things in 3e? They'd revoke my 'Grognards' card and publicly beat me at K&K (and just plain beat me at Dragonsfoot...)

When I was a 3e player, I would over and over again, try countless times to create a rule lite version of d20 such as this. I fact, many of my notes were pretty close to identical to these rules. I just never had the discipline to finish it out. I wanted the D&D basic set to be more like this. As time went on I gravated back to Classic and Advanced, and most recently Original D&D. Microlite20 reminds me a lot of what I like about OD&D. Plain rules. Not tons of crunch, but just enough to make it work. Small spell lists with just enough text description to use, but not too much to overburden the player or GM, or to venture in rule lawyering.

What you guys have here is one amazing project.

Thanks W! It's a very good thing to get your stamp of approval!

 

[Bretbo]

OK, here is the latest updated m20 Modern. Added equipment, but left some out for space considerations; maybe some one will want to do a equipment list containing everything. I left out any "non-real world" elements, leaving that for supplements and such.

As always, feedback welcome (and very helpful so far).

 

[Sadrik]

I would have to say no to multi-classing.

You want to play a wizard warrior? pick up a sword Mr. wizard. You want to play a sneaky fighter? Wear light armor. The differentiation is only +3. A warriory wizard should be created with a high str score. It seems simple enough to me.

I only say these things because I want you guys to have a good product. But warriors are very weak even with using physical skill for BAB. Sure at low level they get a pretty nice boost but as characters go up in level the bonuses flatten out. And you might as well be a wizard that uses a sword or cleric etc. I think this would all be fixed if you used a different sized HD or gave them a HP boost etc. Being a front line fighter means being tough and right now they are no tougher than a few points (difference in starting STR score).

My suggestion would be to do 1d4 for wizard 1d6 for rogue and cleric and 1d8 for warrior. On the same token- You gotta give some reason why the wizard shouldnt go into combat. 1d4 hp/level should accomplish that goal.

 

[greywulf]

I see that my buddy Meepo has been holding out a beautiful gem from me.

W, welcome aboard! Any friend of Meepo's is not to be trusted is a pleasure to meet! Many thanks for the praise. It all goes to our heads. Really, it does.

I'm glad you (and others) see Microlite20's roots. I'm a strict old-schooler who /still/ plays using the D&D Rules Cyclopedia (and Traveller, and Rolemaster, and Dragon Warriors , and .....) when allowed by the other gamers. I swear they just do it to humour me.

I love d20 with a passion, but sometimes I just want to get back to gaming roots where there's no arguing over Attacks of Opportunity. One of my players is still sore after our first 3e game when we spent the whole session "discussing" whether the Ogre gets an OoA if his Rogue tries to Sneak attack him from behind while the Ogre is fighting the Ranger. Then the Ranger wanted an AoO because the Ogre is distracted because of the AoO against the Rogue, and whether the Rogue should then get an AoO before his Sneak attack because of the Ogre resolving the AoO caused by the AoO caused by the Sneak attack. We resolved never, ever, ever to use Attacks of Opportunity again. And I thought Golden Heroes parry rules were complicated!

But I digress. Where was I? Oh yes........

d20 is a great system, but it's just not perfect for every game session, every time. Neither is Microlite20, but hopefully it fills some of the gaps that d20 doesn't fit. Want to game at the pub, on the 'phone or at a friend's house and it's raining too much to haul your precious gaming books out? Microlite20 works just fine. Same for introducing new players, and pleasing the old-schoolers alike.

It's got less filling, yet at the same time it's more filling. Kinda like bran flakes.

I reckon including CHA as an optional fourth Stat will be a popular choice out of the House Rules Macropedia. That and the Turn Undead variations that will undoubtedly creep inside. So you're not alone about with your feelings about those. Options is good, after all

I'm glad that the spell rules have been so well received, frankly. I would be speechless if I were talking and not typing right now.

Thanks for your kind words

Bretbo: thanks for the updated Modern supplement! I'm a bit burnt out from template building right now, so I'll review and upload it onto the main site tomorrow. ok?

Sadrik: I agree entirely, the differentiation is very small, and that's intentional. The only real difference between a Fighter and a Rogue (or a Fighter and another Fighter for that matter, or a Fighter and a Cleric) is how you play him. It's a set of small advantages, that's all. The rest is entirely up to you - just as role-playing should be. That's why I said that multi-classing is largely redundant. Why multi-class if there are no boundaries in the first place

As regards variable hit points levels (d4 for Rogue, etc) and fixed hit points levels, I'm going to collate all of the options and drop 'em into the Macropedia. What you use, and what you do, is entirely up to you.

Again, that's how it should be

EDIT: Bretbo, I just checked the Modern pdf and the license throws the .pdf over to a fourth page. Any chance you could reduce the font size (just on the license) to get it back to three? That aside, you've done a marvelous job compressing the whole ruleset for Modern play onto just two sides. I'm itching to run a spy game now. Think I'll call it "Chicken Royale"......heh......... WELL DONE!!!!

 

[Darrell]

OK, here is the latest updated m20 Modern.

And a darn fine job, too. Good job on the two-page fit. I noticed the same one-line bit in the license throwing it onto a fourth page that 'wulf did, but it didn't bug me that much, as I never print out the license page anyway.

Added equipment, but left some out for space considerations; maybe some one will want to do a equipment list containing everything.

I've been thinking about doing this, but just haven't found the time yet.

I left out any "non-real world" elements, leaving that for supplements and such.

I think that's for the best. Now, if we can get someone to put together a few "magic 'n' monster" pdfs for Modern, we'll be set.

Regards,
Darrell

 

[bytor4232]

OK, here is the latest updated m20 Modern. Added equipment, but left some out for space considerations; maybe some one will want to do a equipment list containing everything. I left out any "non-real world" elements, leaving that for supplements and such.

As always, feedback welcome (and very helpful so far).

Dude! Your amazing! I LOVE it! My daughter and I are going to play this tomorrow night. I'll let you know how it goes.

Do you want me to make a PocketMod version? If so, email me the rtf or doc of your work to dm@aerthon.com. I can work with the PDF for now, it will just be a little harder.

 

[bytor4232]

I think that's for the best. Now, if we can get someone to put together a few "magic 'n' monster" pdfs for Modern, we'll be set.

Dont. Pick up the Monster Manual and d20 Modern and start comparing creatures. There isn't really much of a difference, not enough for Microlite20 to bother with it. Same for Magic. If you want Magic in a spy game, or want to fight a Kobold, just use the stats from Microlite20 Core. Thats what I would do.

In fact, I've run some d20 Modern games like this, where I allowed them to play D&D classes aloung side the d20 Modern characters. It worked out pretty well. The Wizards were a little overpowering, but not that bad.

Thats my 2 copper.

 

[greywulf]

Dont. Pick up the Monster Manual and d20 Modern and start comparing creatures. There isn't really much of a difference, not enough for Microlite20 to bother with it. Same for Magic. If you want Magic in a spy game, or want to fight a Kobold, just use the stats from Microlite20 Core. Thats what I would do.

I'm with Bytor 100% on this. Simplify, don't duplicate. If you want to run a game with Hobgoblins in the subway, just grab the Core, your (excellent) Modern supplement and the Monster List and run with it.

What I'd like to see is a Sci-Fi supplement. Give me lasers, starships and furry aliens. Starships are just Big Creaturs that happen to be made of metal and have other creatures inside them. They have HD, AC and weapons just like an Orc, only on a much larger scale. Your typical Trenchordian Cruiser is HD70, AC45, and a +30 Pulse Canon doing 10d20 damage. Like most starships, it's not affected by any weapon that does less than 20 points of damage. Now you know. And yes, I'm working on this one

One thought - each "era" of play emphasises one of the four skills slightly more than others:

- Subterfuge for Urban Fantasy
- Physical for Conan-style Fantasy
- Knowledge for Modern
- Communication for Sci-Fi

While each skill is important, everywhere, you've more likeley to need this "era" skill more than any other - certainly, it'll be more represented in the party make-up. Your modern spy thriller is all about what you know about who you know. In sci-fi you're using Navigation, contacting alien races and using diplomacy to uncover the mystery. In your Conan-style game, all that matters is how hard you can swing your sword/axe/loincloth. I'm sure different gaming styles come into play here, but that'smy (rough) take on it.

Just a thought.

 

[DJCupboard]

In keeping with the simplicity of m20 and m20 modern, I wonder if we should get so descriptive with our races/monsters/vehicles for the supliments. I know the urge for me is to flush out a campaign world when I start working on supliments (if I ever get internet somewhere other than work, I might even get to post something), but that just might be too much. I know that so far, greywulf, all you have done is give a sci-fi-y name to your star ship, but even that might be too much (I'm really not sure) for microlite. Give the campaign a sufficiently genre evoking name (like, Microlite Space Opera, or something), the stats for Star Cruisers, Cargo Ships, Personal Spacecraft, a few laser blasters and you're pretty much good to go. Anyone interested in a space opera campaign probably already knows the right kind of flavor to add in at the table. Maybe rename elves "martians," dwarves "Miners," and halflings something else, maybe not (Most races in a sci-fi/space opera setting really only differ from humans in terms of what kind of makeup the actors need to put on, anyway). Include a blurb about using monsters straight from the core, with the suggestion that you should come up with uniquely alien sounding names on the fly, only using the stats as befits the type of creature you want the players to encounter. That should help keep even setting supliments in the two page range.

DJC

 

[Bretbo]

Bretbo: thanks for the updated Modern supplement! I'm a bit burnt out from template building right now, so I'll review and upload it onto the main site tomorrow. ok?

Hey Wulf, take your time. As noted, it's still in the brainstorm'n phase so once you think its' ready, then by all means full steam ahead.

EDIT: Bretbo, I just checked the Modern pdf and the license throws the .pdf over to a fourth page. Any chance you could reduce the font size (just on the license) to get it back to three? That aside, you've done a marvelous job compressing the whole ruleset for Modern play onto just two sides. I'm itching to run a spy game now. Think I'll call it "Chicken Royale"......heh......... WELL DONE!!!!

Thanks. Yeah, don't know how I misses that. It's fixed now (and did a little more clean-up in minor ways) so the attachment is all "neat and proper." Let us know how "Chicken Royale" goes.

And a darn fine job, too. Good job on the two-page fit.

Thanks, Darrell. Look forward to seeing what supplements you come up with. After all this project is about "sharing the wealth."

Dude! Your amazing! I LOVE it! My daughter and I are going to play this tomorrow night. I'll let you know how it goes.

Do you want me to make a PocketMod version? If so, email me the rtf or doc of your work to dm@aerthon.com. I can work with the PDF for now, it will just be a little harder.

Thanks, bytor. Man, all this appreciation is going to make my head swell to the point of explosion! Of course, it goes without saying that Wulf is our guru and Overlord...er...I mean inspiration!

Look forward to reading how your game with the daughter goes. As for the PocketMod, I'll certainly send you the original (its' in .doc format), as mentioned above I want to get a "finalized" version before anything more permanent is done. I think we're getting there quickly.