MotW: Forsaker

[Crothian]

Here's an interesting thought. How does the Forsaken know what's magical and what isn't? He has no way to detect magic on his own. Is the use of magic just what the Forsaken realizes is magical or if the forsaken finds a nice MW greataxe and starts using it (not realizing it's plus one) does he all of a sudden lose all Forsaken abilities until he goes clean for a year and a day?

 

[Orco42]

Here's an interesting thought. How does the Forsaken know what's magical and what isn't? He has no way to detect magic on his own. Is the use of magic just what the Forsaken realizes is magical or if the forsaken finds a nice MW greataxe and starts using it (not realizing it's plus one) does he all of a sudden lose all Forsaken abilities until he goes clean for a year and a day?

It says if you use a magic item unwillingly you lose your powers for 1 week.

 

[Marshall]

I'm a CON wh**e. I look at this class and think "Put all of the stat boosts into CON and by 13 char level, when you finish the 10 levels of Forsaker, you can have a CON of (18 base + 3 from char. levels + 10 Forsaker) = 31 as a human with 2 more by 20th lvl. That's a +10 modifier at 13th, so assuming you took those levels as a Barb, you end up with 143-286 Hit point range (average 214.5) at 13th level. Life ain't so bad with that many HP.

Doesnt work. The Stat bonus is Inherent and limited to +5 to any single stat. Good but not overwhelming. And considering you lose the +6 from a cheap enhancement item...

 

[DrSpunj]

This quote got me thinking...

2 problems with this, first the SR wouldn't stack and secondly all th e Monk's abilities that are considered supernatural the Forsaken cannot use. Supernatural is magical.

Absolutely. But this statement got me to pull out the PHB and look at the Monk abilities again, specifically to see if the Wisdom bonus to AC and the AC bonus itself are consdered supernatural and would therefore be lost as a Forsaker. Unfortunately it doesn't say one way the other. I can't find any reference in that paragraph or the general entry that describe what kind of abilities they are.

Looking through the list I can find the following:
Wisdom to AC Bonus ??
AC Bonus ??
Stunning Attack Supernatural
Evasion Extraordinary
Fast Movement <60' ??
>= 60' Supernatural
Still Mind ??
Slow Fall ??
Purity of Body ??
Wholeness of Body Supernatural
Leap of the Clouds ??
Improved Evasion ?? (presumably Extraordinary like Evasion)
Ki Strike Supernatural
Diamond Body Supernatural
Abundant Step Spell-like
Diamond Soul ??
Quivering Palm Supernatural
Timeless Body ??
Tongue of the Sun & Moon ??
Empty Body Supernatural
Perfect Self ?? ("becomes a magical creature")

Is there some governing rule about class abilities that aren't specified? Are they all considered Extraordinary? or because they are unnamed rules about Ex/Sp/Su don't apply? If that's the case, a Monk/Forsaker doesn't gain a lot after Level 5 and Purity of Body IMO except an extra 10' to speed. Some may feel differently and want a few more levels for various things (if they want better unarmed damage, Leap of the Clouds, Improved Evasion, etc.). Regardless, I don't see much point in continuing after getting Improved Evasion at Level 9 given almost everything else for the next several levels is either Supernatural or Spell-like.

Anyone have any specific thoughts on the best class or multiclass-combo to use before prestiging as a Forsaker?

Thanks.

 

[Orco42]

D'oh. You are right.

Doesnt work. The Stat bonus is Inherent and limited to +5 to any single stat. Good but not overwhelming. And considering you lose the +6 from a cheap enhancement item...

I was a idiot and just scanned the class. I thought the ability bonus was unnamed.

 

[The Cardinal]

Re: D'oh. You are right.

I was a idiot and just scanned the class. I thought the ability bonus was unnamed.

damn, damn, damn...and I thought I had found my next character...

 

[Orco42]

Re: Re: D'oh. You are right.

damn, damn, damn...and I thought I had found my next character...

Me too.

Oh well there are other more broken ones in there. Shifter and Verdant Lord are really tough.

 

[Chun-tzu]

Re: This quote got me thinking...

Anyone have any specific thoughts on the best class or multiclass-combo to use before prestiging as a Forsaker?

Thanks.

Well, these aren't class combos, but two thoughts that apply towards making the most of a Forsaker. One, fire arms can go well with a Forsaker, although some might consider smoke powder to be magical. And two, a great partner for a Forsaker would be a Gnome Artificer, from Magic of Faerun. I don't think fire arms or gnome technology are quite as good as magic, but combined with the Forsaker's own abilities, that's a pretty viable (and interesting!) character.

 

[Crothian]

Re: This quote got me thinking...

Anyone have any specific thoughts on the best class or multiclass-combo to use before prestiging as a Forsaker?

Thanks.

Personally, fighter is good for the extra feats. It allows combat versatility. A rogue would also be good because of the sneak attack and the skill points. Maybe Ranger1/Fighter4/Rogue 5/Forsaker 10. I think that would give you a lot of options, especially if you are human.

 

[DrSpunj]

Hmmm...

With no access to magic, this would just make suicide that much more of a surety, but I wonder how many attributes you could add together for an unarmored fighter?

Everyone gets Dex, Monks allow Wisdom, Duelists add Intelligence and Forsakers now allow Constitution. Anyone know of anything that allows Charisma or Strength to AC?

For the min/maxers out there I wonder if you could successfully multiclass a Monk/Fighter into a Duelist before hitting Forsaker for an unarmored/non-magicked crazy person! Maybe one level of Paladin for Divine Grace? Hmm...