You got the part where I cited facts and figures and his response was to say he didn't believe them, ergo calling me a liar, right? The last sentence, at which point I was done with discussing things with him, was the one I'll grant you could have been condescending. But he's ignoring numerous points made by more than one person on the subject and just arguing them for the sake of it, without making any countering point other than 'I don't believe you'. Ergo I don't see a reason to continue using precedent, facts or anything else to discuss it with him.
Necromancer Games NOT going with current GSL.
You got the part where I cited facts and figures and his response was to say he didn't believe them, ergo calling me a liar, right? The last sentence, at which point I was done with discussing things with him, was the one I'll grant you could have been condescending. But he's ignoring numerous points made by more than one person on the subject and just arguing them for the sake of it, without making any countering point other than 'I don't believe you'. Ergo I don't see a reason to continue using precedent, facts or anything else to discuss it with him.
dragonlordofpoondari
Explorer
I understand your frustration. I feel it is always better to error on the side of politeness and respect when faced with a disagreement over information not directly pertaining to your mother or her disposition.
We can all work to make ENWorld a more polite place. Hooray!
jmucchiello
Hero
There's no reason to guess why. Ryan Dancey, who went over TSR's financials as part of the buyout, wrote about it. Although I will admit that it is hard to find if you don't know where to find it. I found it here. But searching for it does not turn up a lot of copies. I know it use to be here on ENWorld but I don't know where to begin looking for it here.
Yeah, I know this article by Ryan. I have already read it. Yet it is not relevant to the health of LGS and TSR's failure. It tells us why TSR suffered and that things had to change. Not that it was doing well and helped running the hobby and suddenly one day someone robbed TSR and run away with the money thus leaving the hobby suffer unexpectedly.
Keefe the Thief
Adventurer
And not only that: The reason for the Edition war is because My Company is better than Your Company.
"Hey, perhaps Your Company could die and benefit My Company - and thusly, D&D?"
"No! - because My Company is the core of D&D, and central for the survival of the hobby!"
See? I have paraphrased this part of the thread. Perhaps we can now return to talking about Necromancers decision?
Voadam
Legend
Still a good read years later.
Raven Crowking
First Post
http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/appeal-to-authority.html
Just because someone claims to have "facts and figures", it doesn't follow that they are correct. This is true even when you believe that the person in question is trying his best to be truthful.
Not accepting your "facts and figures" =/= calling you a liar.
The aforementioned article by Ryan Dancey, for example, has painted a picture that has been questioned by others who were involved with TSR at the time, including Monte Cook. Does that mean that either of them are lying?
I don't think so, and it is noteable that neither claim their viewpoint is the whole truth. There is a difference in someone not accepting your claim, and that person saying that you are intentionally attempting to mislead them.
Of course, YMMV.
RC
dragonlordofpoondari
Explorer
Oh! A logic lesson. I LOVE actual logic.
That is a really good point, and it is easy to confuse the two as they are so closely related. Arumentum ad Verecundiam is in fact the inverse of Argumentum ad Hominem. They are two distinct logical fallacies, yet both are equally fallacious. One most certainly does not lead to the other.
Well put!
GVDammerung
First Post
I'm not shocked or stunned Necro is not going 4e. For reasons others have well explained, the GSL is problematic in the extreme.
What shocks and surprises me is that Necro is _still_ holdoing out hope for a change, modification or "clarification" (that would change the legal essence of the existing language) to the GSL. Its unfathomable.
Paens by Necro to Scott and Linea are funny as they have ZERO control over the content of the GSL or it would not now read as it does.
The thought that Wotc having labored to produce the GSL (giving the matter thought as to what they wanted and imagining their lawyers knew what they were writing) would now change it is sidesplitting.
The underlying thought - that Wotc the company gives a rip about some 3rd Party Publisher's concerns - is even more laughable, given that the GSL took as long as it did and reads as it does.
I see no objective reason to imagine ANY changes or "clarifications" will be forthcoming, and I would be stunned and surprised if they did.
The interesting question to me is - how long Necro will wait at the alter for the groom who never shows up? The GSL dates come and go - and Necro waits. The GSL arrives - and Necro waits. Complaints about the GSL arise - and Necro waits. Other 3PPs abandon the GSL - and Necro waits. Necros seeks "clarifications" to no observeable effect - and Necro waits.
How long will will Necro wait? How long will it whistfully hope that its 4e prince will come? How long until the cold hard light of day makes the painfully obvious impossible to ignore - Wotc has gilted its Necro lover. 6 months from now does Necro admit the GSL is the GSL? A year? Two?
I can see it now - 5e is announced. Necro greets the announcement with a statement that it hopes to have its concerns with the 4e GSL resolved "soon."
This isn't "sad." Its funny as a crutch. "Hey, Moe! Nuck, nuck, nuck!"
What shocks and surprises me is that Necro is _still_ holdoing out hope for a change, modification or "clarification" (that would change the legal essence of the existing language) to the GSL. Its unfathomable.
Paens by Necro to Scott and Linea are funny as they have ZERO control over the content of the GSL or it would not now read as it does.
The thought that Wotc having labored to produce the GSL (giving the matter thought as to what they wanted and imagining their lawyers knew what they were writing) would now change it is sidesplitting.
The underlying thought - that Wotc the company gives a rip about some 3rd Party Publisher's concerns - is even more laughable, given that the GSL took as long as it did and reads as it does.
I see no objective reason to imagine ANY changes or "clarifications" will be forthcoming, and I would be stunned and surprised if they did.
The interesting question to me is - how long Necro will wait at the alter for the groom who never shows up? The GSL dates come and go - and Necro waits. The GSL arrives - and Necro waits. Complaints about the GSL arise - and Necro waits. Other 3PPs abandon the GSL - and Necro waits. Necros seeks "clarifications" to no observeable effect - and Necro waits.
How long will will Necro wait? How long will it whistfully hope that its 4e prince will come? How long until the cold hard light of day makes the painfully obvious impossible to ignore - Wotc has gilted its Necro lover. 6 months from now does Necro admit the GSL is the GSL? A year? Two?
I can see it now - 5e is announced. Necro greets the announcement with a statement that it hopes to have its concerns with the 4e GSL resolved "soon."
This isn't "sad." Its funny as a crutch. "Hey, Moe! Nuck, nuck, nuck!"
