D&D 5E New D&D WotC survey! On classes.

[Neonchameleon]

All of my experiences with having a bard in the party (witnessed as both a fellow player and the DM) can be summed up in the following meme:

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Not pictured: the raiding party of skaven following, hypnotised.

 

[Faolyn]

You have to change almost every ability in some way and modify a lot of the lore, figure out what to give instead of three instruments, etc. It's too much of a hassle for me, so I just default to anti-bard. The cantrip just makes it a bit worse for me this edition.

You don't have to change much of anything besides the flavor text. You can just allow other tools instead of instruments. A storyteller bard is likely to know calligraphy or art. Barring that, you could give them extra expertise in exchange for the instruments, but perhaps in narrow categories (Knowledge: Nobility rather than just History or whatever else you would use) rather than in an entire skull. None of the bardic abilities are really dependant on music, after all.

A bard in one of my current games is a storyteller, and isn't suffering from weird lore or excessive instruments at all.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

Music is mathematics given soul. How people don't see that as an expression of magic is beyond me. While "oh, my great grandpoppy had relations with a dragon" is never even questioned.

Relations with a dragon? HOT. Sometimes literally.

On the other hand, to paraphrase Conan, “Every time I see a bard, I tell ‘em to go have relations with themselves.”

 

[Jfdlsjfd]

First, thanks to all who proposed iconic bards, and mentionned different books I have never read. I fear I am too old to have my mental fantasy imagery change too much (so I associate Merlin with other than class that bard, and Maglor didn't register as a full caster, so not bard despite being a badass fighter proficient with singing and musical instruments, and yes Assurancetourix, so that's not a motivation to play one), but I am pretty sure I'll get good stories to read among your list. So thanks you all !

(There is a strong point to be made about Odysseus be more a rogue than a bard, though. 5e bards are full spellcasters so that quite narrows the mental archetypes and nearly everytime collide with either wizard (academic knowledge) or sorcerer (spontaneous magic)).

I mean, that's basically what I suggested to WotC in this survey - here are the best classes (which is like 6 classes) - bring them all up to that standard.

I fear, also, that the class that will be described as strong will get nerfed into suckiness to narrow the gap instead of improved the best ones. If this had been the goal, they'd have boosted the martial to solve LFQW in 3.5, instead of solving it by nerfing wizards a little and having nearly nobody play at level above 10+ (so even if wizards were still quadratic, nobody would know).

 

[Yaarel]

Re the spell casting focus of a Bard.

To represent the shamanic traditions of many reallife indigenous peoples, the Bard can use a drum as a spell casting focus.



For specifically Celtic (praise or satire) and Norse (spontaneous chant or command) shamans, I do the following.

The Verbal spell component is itself also the spell casting focus.

But here, more specifically, these shamans must verbalize their magic to apply their proficiency bonus to their spell DC. In fact, these Celtic and Norse Bards are psionic, and can cast their spells psionically, silently without any spell components at all. But the verbalization helps focus their magical intention, and they need it to add their proficiency bonus to their psionic manifestation more effectively.



For other kinds of Bard concepts, dancing can be a way to focus the magical intention. In other words, the Somatic spell component serves as the spell casting focus.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

Bard is fine and works well, though I am not sure I quite like the 5e version in the context of 5e class lineup. I feel there are too many full casters and bard could have easily remained a half caster. They're supposed to be the ultimate hybrid, jack of all trades, but now they're pretty much all in with the magic. There are couple of subclasses that can fight, but I think such combat competence should be the default. But of course making them half casters would require pretty much a complete rewrite, as it would require buffing their non-spell capabilities significantly.

 

[Yaarel]

Bard is fine and works well, though I am not sure I quite like the 5e version in the context of 5e class lineup. I feel there are too many full casters and bard could have easily remained a half caster. They're supposed to be the ultimate hybrid, jack of all trades, but now they're pretty much all in with the magic. There are couple of subclasses that can fight, but I think such combat competence should be the default. But of course making them half casters would require pretty much a complete rewrite, as it would require buffing their non-spell capabilities significantly.

The full caster Bard class is more mythologically accurate, such as the Celtic bards, Merlin and Taliesin. I love the 5e Bard as a full caster, and would never go back.

 

[Neonchameleon]

The full caster is more mythologically accurate, such as the Celtic bards, Merlin and Taliesin. I love the the 5e Bard as a full caster, and would never go back.

I disagree, largely because the full caster isn't very mythologically accurate. D&D has ridiculous magic levels.

 

[Greg K]

The full caster Bard class is more mythologically accurate, such as the Celtic bards, Merlin and Taliesin. I love the 5e Bard as a full caster, and would never go back.

I would never go back either.

 

[Yaarel]

I disagree, largely because the full caster isn't very mythologically accurate. D&D has ridiculous magic levels.

A full caster equates to something like a figure who casts powerful spells often enough.