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stonegod

Spawn of Khyber/LEB Judge
What I still can't wrap my head around is why viewing threads normally would fail while seeing posts in the new reply window works fine ...
That is odd. Only guess was that the new reply was loaded before the things went sideways. Other than that, no idea.
 

Lord Sessadore

Explorer
Nope - after things went sideways, I discovered that reading the thread through "New Reply" worked. I caught up on several multi-page threads that way. (Open earlier page, hit new reply, see newest posts.)

My only guess is that there was something in the posts other than the actual text & timestamp that was making the DB throw errors. Can't think of what that would be that wouldn't make older posts fail too. It's a mystery, haha.
 

CaBaNa

Villager
Does anybody know when PHB2 actually comes out? I have heard rumors (from the local bookstore) about the 17th but have no concrete stuff...
 

Lord Sessadore

Explorer
EDIT: I've reposted this in the new discussion thread. Please continue discussion over there (assuming anyone wants to discuss it).

Speaking of the PHB2, someone over on RPG.net just got theirs today/yesterday (they live in Japan, so what day it was depends where you are ;)). Here's a link to the thread, some nice spoilers there. :D
 
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fireinthedust

Villager
I don't see why that is, but the char op threads keep pointing that out. Maybe it's that the implement is a wand, but Locks don't use Dex... or that Cha isn't really a great Wiz option.

I just like the Eldritch Blast as an At-Will, and the Wiz powers and cantrips along with it.
 

WEContact

Villager
It's partly because the two classes are built to do different things in combat (Warlocks are meant to do damage, Wizards are meant to keep monsters from doing what they want to do, for example slowing a brute so that he can't run past the defender to engage the cleric) and partly because Wizards have a lot more options, and much better feats and powers.

I'd really enjoy helping you figure out an effective build that you'd enjoy playing, but I need to know more first. Why do you like Eldritch Blast? Do you like the idea of the power, or do you like that it's a ranged basic attack? Or that it does 1d10 damage? Why do you like Wizard powers, for their mechanics or because they're cool? I think I get why you want cantrips, they have no real mechanical impact in combat so there's only one reason to want them: they're really cool.

Do you want to play a blaster mage, or a sorcerer* who uses illusions and enchantments to keep enemies from attacking?

*not referring to the Sorcerer class here, just using the word as a generic term for magic-user :p
 

fireinthedust

Villager
Well, cool is good for the powers. I want to zap things with eh, describe it like an arcane lightning bolt. I like the 1d10, and having int and cha is great for me. I'd even spend the feat for orbs and wis as they're also cool. I like the books for mages, but being clever and bluffing. The wizard implements are cool. Having an arcane patron is also fun.

I'm thinking that I'd like someone like the wizard in Diablo 3 so eb, ray of frost, and something else. Human this time.
 

WEContact

Villager
Ah, okay. Some things I think I should mention:
First, Warlocks don't do much damage past level 6 or so (around when the extra damage from Warlock's Curse stops being large enough compared to monster hp to matter) but they make up for it by having a lot of control effects. Unfortunately Wizards already do this a lot better, so Warlocks are only ever mediocre.
Second, Wizards are primarily Controllers, and don't do good DPS, unlike diablo 3 Wizards- in fact, the D&D class that is most like the diablo 3 wizard is the Sorcerer, but Sorcerers are 2-stat builds and so human sorcerers tend to be bad, since humans only get one stat boost, and Sorcerers lack Intelligence, which it sounds like you want.
Third, a d10 power doesn't really do any more damage than a d6 power. Damage dice size is pretty meaningless past level 3- what's important is your character's damage modifiers, and how many times you can apply them. Strikers want to be able to deal damage to a target multiple times per round, which is why Rangers are considered the best Strikers.

That said, I think this is your best option: Play a Mage, an Essentials Wizard subclass. Either be a Pyromancer or an Evocation Mage, depending on whether you want to specialize in Fire or Lightning/Thunder. Play a human touched by a primordial of either element, but mechanically you should be a Tiefling or Lightningsoul Genasi. There are no rules against reskinning game elements, as long as you do so in a way that makes sense- reskinning a halfling as a half-giant would be a really bad idea, for example. Tieflings and Genasi both have racial feats that increase their accuracy and damage with elemental attacks, which these builds need to do enough damage to fill the Striker role in a party. (They also need careful magic item selection- read that thread carefully to scrounge every damage bonus you can. Monster HP increases much faster than Striker damage unless you put a lot of work into keeping your damage on par.)

You'll be INT primary, (CHA secondary if you go Tiefling+Fire, STR secondary if you go Genasi+Lightning) with cool element-based spells, and you can MC Warlock if you want, there are some good feats you can unlock by doing so, especially if you're playing the Fire build.
 

fireinthedust

Villager
Hmmm... I hear what you're saying. I don't have Essentials, though, only the regular books (and a bunch of those, actually), and no CB.

If I did go Hybrid WizLock, I picked up the Elemental Chaos players guide, and I saw the elemental path. Also an elemental sorcerer path. I'm considering my options for a SorLock or WizLock, but I have to whip up a team-building adventure for two separate groups (one of them my office, the other my adult siblings!). I had a character in a previous Living 4e game (Emral Dajand, genasi Sorcerer before the elemental one came out: aimed at being an elemental tempest), and I could go back to him with a rebuild maybe? It's just that he's... emotional rather than cunning, and I want to play cunning.

MC Swordmage Aegis looks like it could work with Dagger implements, and that's fun.


I don't want to go just for power, I'm looking for fun and utility. I like the idea of zapping someone with lightning bolts and a solid ray of some kind. That and Flaming Sphere, and I'd like to see if there's a Web power in 4e. Minor teleports are fun, and I like the idea of using Orbs and Wands/Staves for the visual. Otherwise, having Cantrips is a big deal for descriptions and mischief.

The thing is, I like finding sneaky ways of using things rather than going for just combat damage. I could do a good job with a straight Wizard, but Warlock sounds like a fun add-on, and I don't like using feats for MC. I don't know how to add an at-will through MC, or I'd just pick up Eldritch Blast and be done with it.
 

WEContact

Villager
Oh, well if you're looking for powers that do fun utility things rather than just straight damage, Wizard is the way to go. If that's the case, though, I'm not sure why you want Eldritch Blast- it doesn't have any cool effects or tricks, it just does damage. The Wizard's Magic Missile is similar in that it's just a pure blast of arcane power, and it would actually do more damage at early levels, since you don't have the risk of missing or rolling low on a d10. The Mage builds actually get it for free, and you'd still get to pick 3 At-Wills, since you're human! You could get Magic Missile, Ray of Frost/Freezing Burst, Arc Lightning/Thunderwave, and something that targets Will, like Hypnotism or Beguiling Strands! Mages are so fun at low levels because of how many more options they have than other builds.

I tried to send you a PM but your inbox is full. Shoot me an email at wecontact8@gmail.com, and I'll hook you up with all the material you need see for yourself whether a Mage fits the character you have in mind. :)
 

fireinthedust

Villager
Actually, I've been looking over the sorcerer. I like the idea of fixing up my old Genasi from the Turtledome! game a few years back.

With Themes being a thing now, how would I add those to my older character? There's enough material out now I'd want to really overhaul the concept.

EDIT: by which I mean: I want to re-do this guy from the ground up and keep my XP. I think I'd just hit 2nd level!

ALSO: Where do I make a proposal to alter something? I'd like to propose that Genasi stats be altered to +2 Con/Int/Cha instead of Str (or even C/I/Ch/Str?). The reason is that there's a consensus on CharOp boards (I know, but hear me out) that the race was created basically so WOTC would have a Swordmage Race for FRPG. That's well and good, but a classic race tied to the elements should be good at the Class tied to the elements. Right now they make okay wizards, okay warlocks, okay artificers, okay swordmages, and even good barbarians... but they're the fundamental sorcerer race that aren't statted for sorcery.

Granted, some folks may have Genasi with the appropriate stat modifiers... but if we don't have them, or if we could allow Genasi to make better sorcerers also, that would be peachy.
 
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WEContact

Villager
When Enworld failed and was rebuilt, most of the leadership at L4W never came back, and most of the structure, including procedures for adding houserules for the charter, disappeared or became obsolete. All I can say is that changing the ability bonuses available to a particular race for (admittedly valid) thematic reasons is way beyond the scope of any other houserule that's been put into place. It's not the kind of change L4W tends to make, even if I personally think it would make the game better. (I'm a CharOp person myself.)

That said, the best way to represent the character you're describing- a Genasi whose raw connection with the elements is manifested in arcane powers beyond what can be accomplished with the normal, bookish pursuit of arcane arts- is a STR/INT Wizard with the Elemental Empowerment feat, which lets a Genasi Wizard apply his Strength mod to damage like a Sorcerer. Just like a with the sorcerer class, this represents your raw, internal spring of elemental magic empowering your spells. You do Sorcerer damage (as long as you pick elemental spells and not enchantment/necromantic/illusion spells) but you have access to the Wizard's superior powers plus cantrips. It's a great build.

Oh and I'm sure everyone would be fine with you retiring your old character and keeping the XP. Just put a link to your old character sheet in the XP tracking portion of your character sheet so future reviewers know why you started at L2. :)
 

WEContact

Villager
I dunno. Like I said, there isn't really a history of adding huge amounts of homebrew material- usually just very small things, and then only rarely and after a lot of unpleasant debate.
 

dimsdale

Villager
I don't know what was going on this morning, but when I checked Enworld it took me to a gambling site. Was I the only one who had that problem?
 

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