D&D General New Interview with Rob Heinsoo About 4E

[Manbearcat]

I think some of these misinterpret what people actually said. The "mind control" was for powers like Bloody Path, which had on top beholders biting themselves and other nonsense. Any justification for what happened in-game was after the roll was done. Exploration rules ARE lacking, like it or not.
Concerning skill challenges, I presume most people criticized that they didn't work, after several attempts to fix them.

Do you think yours sound like a mature reaction to criticism?

Nope. I was there. I know exactly what was said and by whom. I know how their arguments were misshapen, misunderstood (of the game itself both text-wise and ethose-wise or of how actual phenomena work in the world) and corrected but they refused to operationalize the corrections because it was always deeply, deeply, deeply personal.

And Skill Challenges work perfectly. I've run thousands of them. They work like they do in every indie game that features scene resolution via the same governing principles, techniques and superstructure. Macro scene goal > GM generates thematic/challenging obstacle + consequence-space + player orients to situation (and their currencies) and declares action > resolve > change the situation-state and gamestate according to the imagined state/macro-goal + where we are in relationship to Win Con/Loss Con (using Fail Forward on failures).

Same as all every other game that uses such conflict resolution.

Is it healthy to be this bitter after all this time?

Me? I couldn't be less bitter. I still run 4e. Having it exit stage left in 2012 didn't do anything to impact that. I still go back and run Basic or RC D&D (out of print for decades and decades). No big deal. Game moves on. But mostly, I still run all kinds of different games outside of D&D. And when 5e came out, I was (and still am) happy for those folks who got a game that was well-designed for what they wanted (a GM-driven, storyteller AD&D 3e with some functional indie pieces mixed in for NeoTrad play that could be bolted on or excised without much fuss). Even though its not my thing, I even ran over a two year period to help out a group of kids with their GM who had to miss a lot of sessions (or just flaked). This isn't 9.5 years later and I'm hate-posting agame because I can't possibly check myself and saying the same incorrect things about it that were corrected way back when.

Bitter?

If you ask me to appraise bitterness?

Who are the people hate-posting a game 16_years_later ? Who are/were the people so caught up in some kind of 4E'S TAKIN' OUR JOBS ("stealing their relationship with D&D as a brand or identity" or something)? Who ceremonially burned books both on Facebook and in meatspace? Who actually went out of their way to generate controntations in game shops or in theatre lines? Who waged a 6 year war in every way possible (and in every venue possible), acting like a combination of tantrum-throwing children and jilted lovers, making life utterly miserable for the hobby?

Its embarrassing. And more. Its creepy.

Folks that cannot possibly draw themselves away from a 4e thread to tell us all just how much they hate the game (16 years later) and regurgitate the same wrong things and the same jilted lover perspective these 16 years later? Who is so desperate to talk about market share and books sold constantly...its so, so, so important that 4e's legacy was as a market failure! Just so important!

That is the one of the most weirdly bitter things I've seen in my whole life.

---

And yeah, I know we desperately want there to be an equivalent between someone hate-posting a game 16_years_later + making a hobby utterly miserable for 6 years and someone else that pushes back against both of those things (particularly the things that were just flat out wrong and are still wrong to this day) then and now.

But just no.

There is no equivalent between the two.

 

[Eric V]

And again, I am sorry, but this confirms the conspiratorial tone.

I think this is saying more about your own conspiracy-biased view than anything else, quite frankly. You can say "people meant X when they were saying Y!" but lacking telepathy, we're just going to assume they meant X when they said X, and so @EzekielRaiden 's point stands.

 

[Umbran]

Who are the people hate-posting a game 16_years_later ?

Mod Note:

The problem here is that you are complaining about how long people hold grudges as an unrepentant defense of behavior that incites people to hold grudges.

Thread closed.