New Metamagic option, needs work

[JackOfAllTirades]

I'm considering the creation of a homebrew Metamagic option for altering the damage type of Elemental spells.

What I've got so far:

1) Pick one elemental damage type. Using this Metamagic option, an elemental spell's damage may be converted to that type. The damage type to which damage will be converted should be chosen when this Metamagic option is first taken, and cannot be altered. (Because being able to convert spells to multiple damage types would be potentially very OP.)

2) I'm really not sure how many Sorcery Points this should cost. It's a potentially powerful ability. So far the most costly Metamagic uses 3 SP to give disadvantage on a save. Bypassing resistance or immunity to a damage type will often have the same effect or better. (Either one typically improves your result from half damage to full damage.) Is 3 points too many?

3) I'm not 100% sure which damage types to include. Fire, Cold, Lightning, Thunder, and Acid are definitely on the list. I'm not sure if Poison makes sense to include as well, but from a game design standpoint it would be great if Green Dragon sorcerers didn't completely suck.

4) How does this option compare with other Metamagic options? Is it good enough to be worthwhile?

5) As presented, would this likely be a 3rd level pick, or a 10th level Metamagic choice?

6) Would it make the Elemental Adept feat redundant? Would that be good or bad?

Opinions wanted.

 

[famousringo]

1. Sure, that makes sense and gets the point across that the sorcerer is picking a theme.

2. 3 is definitely too much. Heighten isn't expensive on account of damage spells, its expensive on account of save or suck spells. A Hold Monster will wreck the target more decisively than any blast. If you get around elemental resistance, big deal. Target still gets a save, and defenses like magic resistance, evasion, and legendary resistance still apply. I suggest no more than 2. Honestly, I'd make it 1 except the sorcerer who takes this will also probably get Elemental Affinity or Heart of the Storm bonuses when used.

3. Sure, poison is the crappiest damage type with something like 100 monster being totally immune to it. Anybody willing to carry that lodestone needs all the help they can get.

4. At 1 point, it would be worth considering for the damage versatility or theme, at 2 points, it would be worth considering if supported by subclass features, and I'd never take it otherwise.

5. I'd say that depends on how badly the character wants to push theme. The class features that synergize with damage type don't show up until 6 and resistance is rare at low level. And it's nowhere near as versatile or powerful as Twin or Quicken. The crunch points to 10.

6. Not exactly. If you want to be an "Ice Mage," you still can't power through ice resistance with this. You'd have to abandon your theme and cast your "Icicle Bolt" as a Lightning Bolt again. A true master of ice would want both.

 

[Horwath]

0 sorcery points if single element must be chosen or 1 if you could pick any of 5 elemental types at time of casting.

Personaly, I give that option for free in elemental adept feat(which sucks btw) or at 1st level to dragon sorcerer. Currently only fire sorcerers work because you have enough options to work with.


In 3.5e it was a feat "energy sustitution" that changed elemental damage to element that was tied to your feat. It cost nothing(except the feat).

 

[Eric V]

It's potentially very powerful because of creatures with vulnerability, yes? Are there many of those?

I find myself agreeing with Horwath. It's an option that is necessary to make other dragon types work as "well" as fire sorcerers, so 0 makes sense to me (still costs one of your metamagic choices, so that's not nothing). Being able to change energy on the fly also sounds cool, but in many cases will just be to get around resistance...1 sounds about right to me.

 

[CapnZapp]

It appears the OPs intention is for a metamagic choice that allows an Ice Mage to pick Lightning Bolt, and then choose to cast that as Icicle Bolt instead.

Then I read about the cost in Sorcery Points, and the argument it should cost nothing since it costs a metamagic choice. Have you considered the reverse, making it a class feature that doesn't cost you a metamagic pick, but still costs sorcery points?

To me, that makes the most sense. A Green Dragon Sorcerer should not have to reserve this for one of her few metamagic picks. Sorcerers get few as it is, and it would only be a "pick tax", since I can't imagine any non-fire Sorcerer not picking it.

It does not need to be a late (10th level) pick. It should be an early (3rd level) pick.

As for the cost in Sorcery Points, I disagree about setting it to zero points. Then it's nothing special. And, if the Ice Mage can then choose freely on the spot whether to cast Lightning Bolts or Icicle Bolts (which I don't object to) it's too powerful.

Only if the ability (or metamagic pick) permanently changes one damage type into another would zero SPs be appropriate.

That is, if the Ice Mage permanently gives up the ability to have the spell cause lightning damage, if it always now causes cold damage, then and only then would 0 Sorcery Points be a good idea.

Since I realize that would be a hard sell, that's not the path I would travel.

Instead, I'm advocating you start playtesting with a 1 SP cost, expressly reserving your right to increase it to 2 SP if the results of your playtesting warrants it.

Thus, your Ice Mage picks Lightning Bolt. It will spew lightning unless she spends a Sorcery Point to have it throw bolts of ice instead.

 

[CapnZapp]

In 3.5e it was a feat "energy sustitution" that changed elemental damage to element that was tied to your feat. It cost nothing(except the feat).

It was also horribly overpowered, and I think the OP is on the right track in avoiding such a feature.

 

[CapnZapp]

Personaly, I give that option for free in elemental adept feat(which sucks btw) or at 1st level to dragon sorcerer. Currently only fire sorcerers work because you have enough options to work with.

Agreed, and I note I came up with the same suggestion

(If you do hand it out for free, Mr Tirades, as opposed to costing a metamagic pick, that is, I would still have it cost a sorcery point, if only to reinforce the ability being something special)

 

[CapnZapp]

6. Not exactly. If you want to be an "Ice Mage," you still can't power through ice resistance with this. You'd have to abandon your theme and cast your "Icicle Bolt" as a Lightning Bolt again. A true master of ice would want both.

As I see it, both is what he gets.

He would be able to either cast Lightning Bolt as-is, doing lightning damage, or to use this feature to change it into Icicle Bolt, doing cold damage.

That is powerful, especially from a minmaxing perspective.

I mean, imagine if the OP allowed you to pick "radiant"...

I agree that for, say, poison, it's mostly thematic rather than a real power-up. After all Fireball or Poisonball makes little difference to many undead and fiends.

But let's not judge this by perhaps its weakest application. For a cold or acid sorcerer this would be way cool. For a thunder sorcerer it would probably mean getting the one-up on fire.

Which is why the cost in Sorcery Points should definitely be something more than zero.

 

[Horwath]

It was also horribly overpowered, and I think the OP is on the right track in avoiding such a feature.

No it wasn't. Usually you would get more from spell focus and +1 DC to your spells than with that.

Feat was more of a flavor. as in I want all my elemetal(cold,acid,electricity,fire) spells to be fire spells if I want it.

 

[Bitbrain]

My DM actually homebrewed an item like this for me, since I went cold-themed sorcerer.

basically, for those 1st-5th level spells that deal a specific damage type, I can use the item to change it to any other damage type, by expending a number of charges from the item equivalent to using sorcery points to create new spell slots of 1st-5th level.
I don't use it too much, as I haven't faced anything in the current campaign with resistances to anything except poison and lightning.