New review critical of DUNE: PART TWO based on the depiction of Chani

[MGibster]

Many people who watch the webseries "JourneyQuest" think that Glorion is a hero, for example. And the allusion to exactly the opposite is far from subtle.

There are folks who watch The Boys and somehow manage to walk away thinking Homelander is the good guy. Some people think Rorschach from The Watchman is a good guy. There are always people who aren't going to get it wrong whatever it might happen to be. I suppose some people might miss the point about Paul being so destructive because we don't really see it in the first book. We get to see the hero triumphant, but we don't see the hammer drop until future books.

 

[GreyLord]

There are folks who watch The Boys and somehow manage to walk away thinking Homelander is the good guy. Some people think Rorschach from The Watchman is a good guy. There are always people who aren't going to get it wrong whatever it might happen to be. I suppose some people might miss the point about Paul being so destructive because we don't really see it in the first book. We get to see the hero triumphant, but we don't see the hammer drop until future books.

Spoiler: I think the brutality and destruction is necessary though according to the rest of the books in the series after Children of Dune

If I recall though, not necessarily something Paul succeeds at, but which Leto II does, is that the brutality is necessary. He must be destructive and a massive douche in order to force humanity to flee to the stars, to do anything they could to escape and spread so far and wide that they can never be exterminated. Part of this is also making a human or humans which cannot be seen with his prescience, and thus these can escape from whatever comes to destroy humanity in the future (WH40K????).

 

[Umbran]

Perhaps you are upset? Maybe not?...it's hard to discern emotion from text. Anyway, "I'll bite," "own it," "if you want to pretend," seems a tad aggressive. Maybe your having a bad day? No worries, it happens to me too. Don't worry, though, I'm not coming for you. I just wrote an article on a film.

Mod Note:
You spend your entire opening paragraph effectively noting that you dismiss the critiques based on the poster's emotional state. That is not appropriate.

Please avoid speaking about the poster, as a person. Speak to the points they make. Thanks.

 

[The Soloist]

One of the more famous (here I go, bringing in another franchise) is Blade Runner where supposedly Harrison Ford said he and the director said his character was human, yet, later, it seems that Ridley Scott has heavily (if not outright said, I can't recall if he did or didn't, so won't say he outright said it) indicated that Deckard was an android.

Sometimes, a director lies to the actor because he doesn't want the knowledge to influence his acting. If Ford had known Deckard was an android, it would have affected how he portrayed his character. Scott didn't want that.

 

[Hatmatter]

Wow, I've not even seen the film, and the book is a distant memory coloured by the David Lynch film, but that was a brilliant piece of writing!

Thanks, S'mon...and thanks for reading. Cheers!

 

[Stalker0]

Interesting enough, a lot of folks were disappointed in Shogun 2024, becasue it didnt lead up to an action packed warscape at the end. I, for one, enjoy a break from the blockbuster break neck pace action experience that we are getting.

Coming into this one a bit late. I've made the point before that I think this is a conflict with a difference between eastern and western notions of story telling.

We westerners like the big ending, everything tied up in a bow, we want a definitive conclusion to the tale.

Many Japanese stories (which you can see in a lot of anime before it was more westernized but still see it some today), have this element of "we are talking about a moment in time, and the journey always continues, with more love, more battles, more death, more life". So there is this element of "and the hero continues the journey" without any real conclusion.

In many ways as the execution is about to take place, and we hear laments about all of the battles and schemes and plots that they will never get to see or take part in, that is also meant as a relation to the audience, and ultimately to life. The audience will also never see those plots and battles and schemes....because in life there will always be more beyond what we get to see, new stories we will never read because we get X amount of time, and then its on to the next person.

 

[Hatmatter]

Coming into this one a bit late. I've made the point before that I think this is a conflict with a difference between eastern and western notions of story telling.

We westerners like the big ending, everything tied up in a bow, we want a definitive conclusion to the tale.

Many Japanese stories (which you can see in a lot of anime before it was more westernized but still see it some today), have this element of "we are talking about a moment in time, and the journey always continues, with more love, more battles, more death, more life". So there is this element of "and the hero continues the journey" without any real conclusion.

In many ways as the execution is about to take place, and we hear laments about all of the battles and schemes and plots that they will never get to see or take part in, that is also meant as a relation to the audience, and ultimately to life. The audience will also never see those plots and battles and schemes....because in life there will always be more beyond what we get to see, new stories we will never read because we get X amount of time, and then its on to the next person.

Nice!

 

[Stalker0]

What makes you view Chani's character in this way? Why did she leave him right after his proposal? Why was her departure edited such that it was made to appear connected to her being upset with the proposal?

I actually just watched that part of the movie again to check myself. She does not leave after the proposal, she only leaves when you see sees all of the emperor's men and the fremen bowing before Paul as the emperor, and he gives her the look like "are you coming?"

And that's when she leaves...the rejection of what he has become.

Nor does she storm out raging and crying, she honestly walks out pretty calmly. She is clearly mad, but I don't get any tantrum signs or anything like that.

 

[Hatmatter]

I actually just watched that part of the movie again to check myself. She does not leave after the proposal, she only leaves when you see sees all of the emperor's men and the fremen bowing before Paul as the emperor, and he gives her the look like "are you coming?"

And that's when she leaves...the rejection of what he has become.

Nor does she storm out raging and crying, she honestly walks out pretty calmly. She is clearly mad, but I don't get any tantrum signs or anything like that.

Thanks. It has been a few months....can you tell me how much time is there between the proposal and the Fremen bowing? I recall it being quite short -- a couple minutes; or is it longer? What reaction does she give when Paul proposes marriage to the Princess?

By the way, no one ever claimed she stormed out raging and crying. Chani is consistently depicted as a stoic character. Romantic pique does not necessitate raging and crying.

 

[Stalker0]

Thanks. It has been a few months....can you tell me how much time is there between the proposal and the Fremen bowing? I recall it being quite short -- a couple minutes; or is it longer? What reaction does she give when Paul proposes marriage to the Princess?

By the way, no one ever claimed she stormed out raging and crying. Chani is consistently depicted as a stoic character. Romantic pique does not necessitate raging and crying.

The proposal being when he says "I will take the hand of your daughter, and we will rule togther". Chani has a gasp, and is notably surprised, but then stays pretty stoic through the next exchanges. She does avoid Paul's eyes as he gets near her and prepares himself for the duel.

During the fight she shows clear signs of worry for him especially when he is injured.

The bow and Chani's walkout happens ~ 8.5 minutes after the proposal is mentioned