D&D (2024) New Spell: Befuddlement

[Lanefan]

I have never in my almost 50 years heard "befuddled" used to refer to an alcoholic. Definity seems to be a stretch.

I've heard "befuddled" used on rare occasions as one of hundreds of words to mean "drunk"; more commonly used are tipsy, sloshed, loaded, hosed, etc., etc.

Never heard it used to mean "alcoholic". That said, there are those few sad folks out there who think that people who get drunk just once must be alcoholics; so maybe there's that tenuous connection?

 

[Lanefan]

I don't think sensitivity really had anything to do with it at all. I think the reason they removed Feeblemind is because it says this:



That effectively removes a player from play. Having played characters in 3e that got Feebleminded, it was a miserable couple of play sessions, especially because we were in The Abyss with no way to escape and correct it for the foreseeable future.

How is that any different from if your character had died while in the Abyss?

 

[Mirrorrorrim]

How is that any different from if your character had died while in the Abyss?

I don't know about them, but if my character died in the Abyss, the party is rescuing a new NPC-turned PC to step in.

Do you just sit and watch people if your character dies? Or stop coming to the game?

 

[Stalker0]

I don't think sensitivity really had anything to do with it at all. I think the reason they removed Feeblemind is because it says this:



That effectively removes a player from play. Having played characters in 3e that got Feebleminded, it was a miserable couple of play sessions, especially because we were in The Abyss with no way to escape and correct it for the foreseeable future. Eventually, the DM just handwaved it going away because it was clearly not going to be fixed in a reasonable time frame.

Honestly, though, I'm surprised the new spell doesn't grant a save daily and permit characters to use cantrips.

I would buy this if they did it across the board. there are many spells that were way altered FAR more than feeblemind was that didn't get a name change (just look at the summon spells for an example).

That's why I found it so interesting, that out of all the spell changes they did, ONLY this one warranted a name change that now breaks backwards compatibility.

I mean frankly I've heard the word "slow" used for people with mental impairments far more than feebleminded, but we didn't suddenly drop the slow spell.

I just find it very interesting that this was the one spell in the entire batch that got a change for inclusion reasons.

 

[Lanefan]

I don't know about them, but if my character died in the Abyss, the party is rescuing a new NPC-turned PC to step in.

Do you just sit and watch people if your character dies? Or stop coming to the game?

To the latter questions: yes (or roll for an adventuring NPC if there's one in the party); and maybe yes if it's certain my character will be dead or otherwise out of action for some time and there's no way to get a replacement in.

For something like that long Abyss adventure used as the example just upthread, were I the DM I'd drop some loud hints that they might want to bring two characters each on this trip because in-the-field replacement won't be possible should anyone die or otherwise become unplayable. I'd also try to ensure there's at least one adventuring NPC in the group as a second fallback.

 

[Chaosmancer]

As a general note, I have never in > 25 years of Medicine ever referred to people with substance abuse issues as "befuddled". Rather impaired, drunk, intoxicated, obtunded, delirious, altered and occasionally as unfortunate. Nor, for that matter, have I ever referred to people with cognitive impairments as "befuddled". Since those situations tend to be from genetic, congenital, or traumatic situations those descriptors tend towards greater precision.

EtA: Nor have I used "feebleminded" medically, or in any way other than the spell name, come to think of it.

(I understand that you, Chaosmancer, are explaining and not making that specific claim.)

Agreed, not that I practice medicine, but I actually don't hear anyone use the term befuddled very much.

 

[Bacon Bits]

I would buy this if they did it across the board. there are many spells that were way altered FAR more than feeblemind was that didn't get a name change (just look at the summon spells for an example).

Looking at the changes made for 5e.24, and the design of 5e in general, I think the one word that would never cross my mind about them would be "consistent." There are parts that are well designed. There are parts that are just 1974. There are parts that are 1979. There are parts that don't make sense. It is a patchwork quilt of game mechanics.

I think it's pretty clear that the playtest was truncated to meet the 50th anniversary goals I remember thinking in late 2022 when they announced it that they already didn't have enough time. So what we got is rushed. They fixed some of the things, and few of the major things, but they made the deadline, mostly. So we're going to have 6+ years of the rules being worded like Dual Wielder, meant to hide the design intended to police the rules rather that explain what they want it to do.

 

[Bacon Bits]

To the latter questions: yes (or roll for an adventuring NPC if there's one in the party); and maybe yes if it's certain my character will be dead or otherwise out of action for some time and there's no way to get a replacement in.

For something like that long Abyss adventure used as the example just upthread, were I the DM I'd drop some loud hints that they might want to bring two characters each on this trip because in-the-field replacement won't be possible should anyone die or otherwise become unplayable. I'd also try to ensure there's at least one adventuring NPC in the group as a second fallback.

It wasn't a long adventure. Or, well, there wasn't much left. It was just that I got hit immediately after we got to the important part of The Abyss at the start of the session, which was actually supposed to be close to the very end of the adventure. We had already killed just about everything. And we couldn't heal it because the cleric player was absent for a few weeks. Ostensibly, that was okay; we had a magic item that someone else could use... a staff of life that anybody good aligned could use. Which by this point meant... the cleric or myself the paladin. Unfortunately, the staff was command word activated. You start to see the problem. I also had a holy mace of my deity that let me cast greater restoration once a week (among other things). But, again, it was command word activated. Oh, sweet ironies.

The other part of the issue was that... I think it started to just frustrate the DM. He made the whole dungeon after killing the boss a puzzle, and I was the only one that figured it out. We spent two sessions wandering around the demon web pits finding clue after clue, and random encounter after random encounter, and none of the other four players that were there figured out what was going on. I passed a note to the DM (I mean I was bored) that indicated I knew exactly what the issue was, exactly what we needed to do, and exactly which room we needed to do it in. But the other players decided they needed to withdraw and rest or try to find a way out, which they couldn't. I think the thing we needed to destroy was also dimensionally locking the whole complex. That's why we needed a MacGuffin to get there. So it was just going to get progressively more frustrating and TPK the party. Nobody was having fun anymore.

At the end of the second session, the DM said, "OK, while you guys are hiding out trying to rest, and the paladin's holy artifact mace breaks his Feeblemind," basically. He dressed it up, but that's what happened. We beat the adventure the next session.

Honestly, the DM just expected me not to fail the save, and maybe forgot that those things were command word activated. I still have that character saved on my Google Drive because it was such a good campaign. At 15th level as a single class human paladin I had a +15 Will save before any buffs, and Feeblemind was a 5th level spell then so from the trap that I triggered it was only DC 17. I literally had to roll a 1 to fail. My character had famously survived Disintegrate traps perhaps... two dozen times? Every time there was a trap that we missed, somehow I always managed to trigger it. It became a running joke that it was always Disintegrate magic. Part of the reason I was so good looking was because I exfoliated regularly!

If I had it to do again, I would just tell the other players what was going on. The fact that my character was out of commission shouldn't remove me as a player from collaborative play. Several other characters in the party had high Int. They should be able to figure it out even if me as a player with no character is the one doing it. But few D&D players think the game plays like that, and even fewer thought like that ~20 years ago. Still, I have no doubt that most people that only play D&D even today would not like that.

That turned into a sort of bittersweet ending for a very, very long campaign. About 5 years spanning AD&D and the migration to 3e. Shortly after, I ended up taking a job and moved across the country for a few years like a month later. I've since moved back and play with mostly the same group, though. So definitely a happy ending really.