D&D 5E No One Plays High Level?

[Minigiant]

The higher level you get, the more you suck!

Let's see. 20th level wizard.

1. Spellcasting.
2. Arcane Recovery
3. Ritual Casting
4-9. Feats(because stat increases aren't worth it)
10. Spell Mastery
11. Signature Spell
12. Divination Savant
13. Portent
14. Expert Divination
15. The Third Eye
16. Greater Portent

The mighty archmage with his 4 actual spell slots spread over cantrips to 9th level! Fear him!

Edit: No, wait. Without stat increases he probably only has 14-16 int and has no spells at all. lol

Again read the first explanation.

Spell Mastery is an active ability. And having more low level slot is a problem. Cut.
Signature Spell is an active ability. And having more low level slot is the problem. Cut
Divination Savant doesn't really do anything.
Features that upgrade are replaced. Portent is replaced by Greater Portent.
Expert Divination is an active ability. And having more low level slot is THE problem.. CUT
The Third Eye is an active ability. But it's must noncombat and thus doesn't add to paralysis

Lets say 20 NT mean 20 Slots

1. Spellcasting: Full Caster
2. Arcane Recovery
3. Ritual Casting
4. Combat Cantrip 1
5. Combat Cantrip 2
6. Utility Cantrips
   1. Utility Cantrip
   2. Utility Cantrip
   3. Utility Cantrip
7. Level 9 Spell
8. Level 8 Spell
9. Level 7 Spell
10. Level 6 Spell
11. Level 5 or lower Spell
12. Another Spell
13. Another Spell
14. Another Spell
15. Feat
16. Feat
17. Feat
18. Feat
19. School of Divination: Greater Portent
20. School of Divination: Third Eye

So in combat, a Wizard Player or Wizard DM only has to ever manage 11 spells. And if some are mage armor and shield, you are only thinking about 9. And some don't have to be combat spells.

 

[Maxperson]

Again read the first explanation.

Spell Mastery is an active ability. And having more low level slot is a problem. Cut.
Signature Spell is an active ability. And having more low level slot is the problem. Cut
Divination Savant doesn't really do anything.
Features that upgrade are replaced. Portent is replaced by Greater Portent.
Expert Divination is an active ability. And having more low level slot is THE problem.. CUT
The Third Eye is an active ability. But it's must noncombat and thus doesn't add to paralysis

Lets say 20 NT mean 20 Slots

1. Spellcasting: Full Caster
2. Arcane Recovery
3. Ritual Casting
4. Combat Cantrip 1
5. Combat Cantrip 2
6. Utility Cantrips
   1. Utility Cantrip
   2. Utility Cantrip
   3. Utility Cantrip
7. Level 9 Spell
8. Level 8 Spell
9. Level 7 Spell
10. Level 6 Spell
11. Level 5 or lower Spell
12. Another Spell
13. Another Spell
14. Another Spell
15. Feat
16. Feat
17. Feat
18. Feat
19. School of Divination: Greater Portent
20. School of Divination: Third Eye

So in combat, a Wizard Player or Wizard DM only has to ever manage 11 spells. And if some are mage armor and shield, you are only thinking about 9. And some don't have to be combat spells.

Having a single spell of any given level to cast is a major problem. This idea just doesn't work for D&D.

 

[Minigiant]

I don't think people understand how dangerous cannon were. A napoleonic cannon ball had way better range than a lightning bolt spell, effective to more than a mile. Anything or anyone you hit becomes shrapnel. You do grazing shots and get rocks and cobbles flying on each bounce. You hit a ship and turn the hull into a wood shotgun blast, ripping up foot-long "splinters" of wood the size of a crosshow bolt and sending them flying. And then there's shot and cannister, a straight up cone of shrapnel or bullets ranging from 1800ft - 2700ft long.

One of the biggest mistakes that D&D did is not have gunpowder cannons be default in the settings.

The High level Evil Fighter with a cannon, greatsword, and musket should be as scary as an Evil Archmage.

Warhammer and other fantasy worlds got this right.

 

[Minigiant]

Having a single spell of any given level to cast is a major problem. This idea just doesn't work for D&D.

12-14 are other spell options. As well as the feats as optional choices.

The problem is the options and resources players and DMs want are what make no one play high levels.
Active Options and Resources should not continuously increase.

 

[W'rkncacnter]

One of the biggest mistakes that D&D did is not have gunpowder cannons be default in the settings.

The High level Evil Fighter with a cannon, greatsword, and musket should be as scary as an Evil Archmage.

Warhammer and other fantasy worlds got this right.

i always had a feeling demoknight should've been a viable build in DND.

 

[kigmatzomat]

The problem is the options and resources players and DMs want are what make no one play high levels.

Correction:It may be why you don't play high level. This thread is proof that some people play high levels because of the very features you decry.

Which is why there are multiple games on the market; because no one game is all things to all people.

 

[Minigiant]

Correction:It may be why you don't play high level. This thread is proof that some people play high levels because of the very features you decry.

Which is why there are multiple games on the market; because no one game is all things to all people.

It's some people but not most people.

What most D&D fans want for D&D is why most fans doesn't play High level D&D.

Most fans want a version of high level D&D that they are not able to play.
Their preferences creates either bad or hard character creation or gameplay.

 

[Maxperson]

12-14 are other spell options. As well as the feats as optional choices.

The problem is the options and resources players and DMs want are what make no one play high levels.
Active Options and Resources should not continuously increase.

12-14 are included in the 1 spell per spell level. It simply isn't enough, and feats aren't really all that optional. Stat raises are junk in comparison to feats, so that just leaves feats.

 

[Micah Sweet]

One of the biggest mistakes that D&D did is not have gunpowder cannons be default in the settings.

The High level Evil Fighter with a cannon, greatsword, and musket should be as scary as an Evil Archmage.

Warhammer and other fantasy worlds got this right.

Could not agree more with this!

 

[Minigiant]

12-14 are included in the 1 spell per spell level. It simply isn't enough, and feats aren't really all that optional. Stat raises are junk in comparison to feats, so that just leaves feats.

Humans can't handle so many options unless they've been eased into it over time.
But people don't play long enough to ease into conceptualizing that many spells.

That is the problem.
A high level D&D character has too many active features to memorize in one go (starting at high level)

Fans want D&D to give them high level PCs they cannot handle, high level campaigns they wont sit through, and high level settings they wont settle into.