Odd Peeves [2002 Thread]

[King_Stannis]

i'm a dm myself, so on the rare occasions i get to play i almost universally ask the dm of the game what type of character would fit in best to the adventure/campaign we will be playing. maybe that's not fair, as i'm not a full time player and only have to "live" with my character for a short time, but i think it really helps the dm out and i would rather everyone have a good time and have the characters fit together than to play a drow/barbarian/wizard to satiate my hunger for method roleplaying.

speaking as a dm, sometimes it's really a challenge to fit such a wide diversity of characters into a group. you have the evil thief, the good paladin, the mercenary fighter, etc....the players may love their character on its own merits, but might not consider how that character will fit into the grand scheme of things. i suppose that's the dm's job, but sometimes even the best dm's explanations for how and why a group would travel/fight/risk-their-lives for one another can end up being hokey (to say the least!).

i am fortunate in that most of my group consults me and we can usually taylor the characters to what i have in mind for the campaign. still, there have been a few times when i have had to do some real juggling to come up with a reason why a whole hodgepodge of characters (that run the spectrum of alignments and motivations) is risking their lives for one another.

 

[bondetamp]

Re: carried?

Well, gosh darn it you mean this isn't real life? I'm not really a dwarven fighter?!? Thank you for revealing the truth to me.

My pleasure. I try to spread some light where ever I go.

Ok, I might have come across as an arrogant tit. Sorry about that.

My point is that you might lose something by exclusively going for the optimal statistical value. Whether this is something that you would personally feel enrichened your game and increased your fun, is, of course, something only you can know.

That said, there is nothing inheritly better, roleplayingwise, about a half-orc bard and a halfling monk than a half-orc barbarian and a halfling rogue. But neither is there anything inheritly worse. A rebel is no better than a conformist in this regard. If someone has an urge to play a war like battle skald, and feels that a half-orc bard fits him to a tee, then that's where the difference is.

The roleplayers who love to harp on metagaming are exhibiting the worst form of it, by making their characters accept irrational choices. That's what it really comes down to.

I, personally, have no problems with metagaming. It is a tool as any other. The problem comes when it is used in a fashion that ruins the rest of the group's fun. If I know that the DM has spent several days comming up with an adventure involving going in to slay a dragon, then my character will do that even if he might have found it better to do something else. If my character has developped a romantic interest towards another PC and I feel that the player feels uncomfortable about this, then I wind it down or drop it. If a player has spent the weekend making a PC to join our party, then my PC will welcome him (grudgingly, unwilling, with open arms or othervise) even if he wouldn't have done so according to the back story. I see no point in ruining the fun because of some arbitrarilly placed "fourth wall".

It should probably be noted, though, that I don't really consider myself a "True Roleplayer". I might be closer to that label than any other label, but it isn't something that I would pursue with any sense of consistency.

However, have fun. I certainly don't care what you do in your campaign.

That is certanly very kind of you.

What I do dislike is getting a disfunctional character glommed onto my party in a LG game where I don't get to choose.

And if the rest of the players feel the same way, you shouldn't have to. The characters should be made to fit the players, not just the player.

As such, a half-orc bard (which, actually can be quite good, but let's keep it as an example) probably shouldn't be made for a convention game where you don't know the DM or the other players. A convention character should be made to fit into any kind of group and would have to have strengths and weaknesses based on this.

 

[buzzard]

Re: Re: carried?

And if the rest of the players feel the same way, you shouldn't have to. The characters should be made to fit the players, not just the player.

As such, a half-orc bard (which, actually can be quite good, but let's keep it as an example) probably shouldn't be made for a convention game where you don't know the DM or the other players. A convention character should be made to fit into any kind of group and would have to have strengths and weaknesses based on this.

Here we have agreement. My peeve is all really about the LG games. The problem is that people in those game don't appear to have the courtesy you would exhibit in designing a character for a random party. As I mentioned in the initial part of the thread- someone was playing a "runner"- a cowardly fighter. An individual with no utility. We should have left him at the Inn, and gone about our business, however LG doesn't seem to work that way.

Buzzard

 

[bondetamp]

It suddenly appeared to me that LG, in this context means Living Greyhawk not Lawful Good.

Everything suddenly became a bit clearer.

 

[Impeesa]

Re: Re: Re: carried?

Ok, I'm choosing a number of people to go out with and risk our lives in pursuit of adventure, and possibly wealth. Do I pick:
A) a big strong fighter who can hold his own in battle
or
B) an angst ridden half orc bard who will hang around telling stories while the rest of us get hacked up, and then will expect a share of the loot. He's not particularly talented, and seems fairly incapable of talking his way out of tight spots.

Of course all of those special forces teams in Afghanistan all made sure they had a ugly, stupid, amateur entertainer with them to help with their productivity.

You want to talk about meta game knowledge? That comes when you have a bunch of people forming a band of adventurers which is willing to carry around deadwood which only serves to cause more danger. A rational adventurer would send said deadwood merrily on his way to tell more stories and not risk getting killed.

Buzzard

Alright, let me say that I'm really a powergamer at heart. That said, I'd like to point out a few things:

1) This character was made for an *e-mail* game. That means there's not too much combat to begin with, and (eventually) more social maneuvering.
2) A slick young human bard/rogue draws attention playing the crowd at, say, a royal ball. A kindly, middle-aged half-orc chatting with the older nobles does not (don't ask how we got invited in the first place).
3) I said he looked down on *conventional* weapon fighting. First combat we actually got into, some goblin went for the back lines and scratched me up. I snapped his neck.

I'm probably forgetting some other important points, but I don't feel like re-reading the thread again.

--Impeesa--

 

[Pielorinho]

As for how the goblin/flaming morningstar character got approved, I have no earthly idea. I only know that he was nightmarishly irritating.

Daniel

 

[birdboy2000]

Personally, I play a Halfling/Kender hybrid(His father was a kender who was sent off krynn in an adventuring accident) Were-tiger rogue/druid with anime ethnicity raised by a monster race in my game based off katos from monster rancher. I think that a weird race/class or even class/class combo is a start, but even a dwarven fighter or elven wizard can have an interesting enough background to be a good character. And if you can't think up something that good, feel free to play an anime character(I might play an elven paladin based off Holy Angemon next.)

 

[beldar1215]

If you hated the character so much you could have said something at the time. Maybe it is an ill concieved character, but I was trying to do something different. Just let me know who you are and I will avoid you at all costs. The idea to call him a "runner" came from someone who didn't seem to mind the character!!!

 

[Pielorinho]

Personally, I play a Halfling/Kender hybrid(His father was a kender who was sent off krynn in an adventuring accident) Were-tiger rogue/druid with anime ethnicity raised by a monster race in my game based off katos from monster rancher.

Gee, Birdboy. Like I don't have enough trouble sleeping at night as it is. Thanks a lot for the image!

Daniel

 

[Desdichado]

The roleplayers who love to harp on metagaming are exhibiting the worst form of it, by making their characters accept irrational choices. That's what it really comes down to.

What's irrational is that all half-orcs will be barbarians. That's irrational. Oh, also referring to half-orc barbarians as rank amateurs and deadwood is irrational. Or, at least, it's not logical.