Ogres As Characters

[DM_Matt]

Come to think of it, maybe levels in monk would be better.

It provides some order to its savage behavior, would still be incredibly savage but able to actually deal with the world around it. Go into its on little version or torpur whenever the world gets to be too much or lashes out at anything.. Perhaps some flavor text concentration checks here and there

HalfOgre/dwarf and feral. Going up in monk levels. Lots of flavor, make sure he never uses a weapon, ever. If he cant tear it limb from limb with his hands what is the point?

It would get rid of at least part of the problem people are having with each template, would have a lot of fun flavor times, and would almost be impossible to min/max to sufficient power to make people upset. Just getting it into usefulness would be a bit of a challenge even. But fun!!

Feral abilities are based onmonster hit die only, so it doesnt work for this.
Also, HOgre is a race, not a template.

 

[Scion]

It works fine, reread the feral template

 

[LGodamus]

Feral is based on racial hit dice , not levels .......so an orc or a half orc gets pretty much jack nothing....an Ogre would get some decent stuff , though.

 

[jgsugden]

I repeat:

The best advice I can give is for DMs to work up some mock characters and try them out in a mock dungeon adventure that is representative of your game. Then decide for yourself. Based upon my experience, this comparison between a human barbarian and a HOgre barbarian with a +1 LA is not even close in practical play. We can throw numbers back and forth all day, but in the end, experience is the only thing you can trust. I know what my experience told me. You can decide for yourself.

 

[Scion]

of course jg I was just hopeing to get enough info that the dm could make an informed decission, that is all.

Both to dm_matt and lgodamus.

the feral template will grant a 0 hd race with the following:

Type: changes to monstrous humanoid
Speed: land speed increases by 10'
AC: +6 natural armor bonus
Attacks: gains 2 claw attacks, damage based on your size
Special attacks: dependent on racial HD, so none.
Special Qualities: dependent on total HD, so darkvision and fast healing.
Abilities: +4 str, -2 dex, +2 con, -4 int (min 2), +2 wis
LA +1

while it isnt absolutely incredible and you lose some of the bonuses of the halfogre, but that should merely make some people who say the halfogre is too strong happy

I still think it could be a very interesting, though difficult, character to play. You would have to put at least 10 point buy points into int just to keep it at a somewhat reasonable level, tell characters that they cant have a starting stat above 22 (so they can drop 4 points to hit it if they so choose but should be easier for most dm's to adjucate), the rest would be to make the guy a well rounded character. mmm.. monk halfogre and feral..lol.. may have to try something like that in the future

 

[Larcen]

His BAB will suck...DD grants cleric BaB AND he loses a level AND he is getting no bab for his sorc elvel

I figured his DD STR bonuses would make up for this. Especially at the 10th level DD payoff. (Of course it's long wait until then.)

Besides, I am looking forward to the other DD benefits as well.

...what L1 spells will even be useful in th elong run?...

You make it sound like the level of Sorcerer will be totally useless. I can think of several spells that would be useful to anyone. Most of them can be used out of melee so they will not sacrifice valuable hacking time. I'm sure you can't deny the usefulness of these spells, in and out of battle:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dancing Lights, Detect Magic, Detect Poison, Ghost Sound, Light, Mage Hand, Mending, Message, Prestidigitation, Read Magic, Comprehend Languages, Detect Secret Doors, Disguise Self, Endure Elements, Enlarge Person, Expeditious Retreat,Feather Fall, Grease, Hold Portal, Identify, Jump, Magic Weapon, Mount, Obscuring Mist, Protection From Evil, Reduce Person, Shield, Silent Image, Summon Monster I, True Strike, Unseen Servant, Ventriloquism
~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Hey, if all he did with his spells powers was to detect for secret doors and magic, the party would still appreciate that I think. And there are even better spells on that list.

I wonder how effective will an Enlarged half-0gre be?

 

[CRGreathouse]

Frankly, I'm surprised that anyone considers allowing half-ogres as a PC race at LA +1. Compared to any of the other LA +1 races, they're incredibly powerful... and past level 3, undeniably (IMO) more powerful than a core race one level higher.

I've seen some DMs allow them at LA +2, and others deny them at LA +2 (for balance, not gameplay, reasons; they're 'too powerful' at +2). I'm not sure which camp I'd fall into if I was considering them as a PC race, but it certainly wouldn't be +1.

 

[Scion]

Like I said earlier, just because other +1's suck a lot doesnt mean that they all have to. Such as the tiefling and assimar, they are on the incredily low end of the +1 scale. They could easily be used as a +0 race, but a strong one. How much more powerful are they than dwarves after all? A little here and there, but still, incredibly weak as a +1. So the halfogre is on the stronger side of +1, or a very weak +2. Personally I'd rather just set a limit to how high a characters starting stat can be and move on. It is easier, and there shouldnt be any balance problems.

 

[Larcen]

...Personally I'd rather just set a limit to how high a characters starting stat can be and move on. It is easier, and there shouldnt be any balance problems.

If you do that, what's the sense of even taking a half-ogre? I would think anyone taking one is doing it because he is getting above normal starting stats. I know that's one of the biggest reasons I am thinking about it. Otherwise, just give me the half-orc.

 

[Scion]

Because you are getting the higher bonus for cheaper, you are able to play the character you want, and you are able to get other appropriate feats not open to other characters.

I didnt say it was a great option, I said it was an option to those who feel that the race is too powerful. I said I would rather that be what happens over making it a +2 LA which weakens it too much.

Of course if you think that the halforc as written is a worthwhile race then we have nothing left to talk about..lol.. it has some serious 'issues' that need to be worked through.