OOC Kingdom of Ashes IV - Who's yo' daddy?

The_Universe said:
On the other hand, I do think it's become pretty clear that most of the group finds a session of pure role playing more than a little boring and frustrating.

Unless you'd prefer to do it in-session. :)

Just let me know.

I think that, for this particular portion of planning, we need to have the whole group together in order to make the necessary decisions. This is big, big stuff. Things that we need everyone's opinions in order to move on.

We can make lists of options and possibilities... but, I don't think that the game can really move forward on any fronts until we have the full group back here... if it were just one person-- it wouldn't be a big deal. But, it is two and I think it is unfair to cut them out of this decision making process.

I think the Jaine thing can be moved on-- I don't think it is all important to have the discussion with her IC... we are just going to tell her what her options are and she's going to make a decision.

So far as the rebellion in the North goes, we need Greg here to make those decisions. Even if he was here, we'd need to do it in session b/c he doesn't participate in email or message board conversations.

However actual scouting and negotiations with Big Blue are something that everyone should be a part of, I think. Now, if I am wrong and no one else agrees-- fine we can move on. But, I think at this point, aside from simple information gathering through scrying, we should wait for the love-birds to return home.
 
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Xath said:
Very nice. Looks like we may be hooking up with some interesting people, to say the least. So what's the plan? Can someone sumup what we have agreed upon so far?
(Pretend, for a moment, that I am a PC)

As Liz has noted, there isn't a lot that you have agreed upon, in total.

As it stands, you have a bunch of related problems, all tied up in a knot. If you pull the right cord, it might start to unravel, but knowing which cord to pull is, of course, tough. But that's what makes it a good story.

Your problems:

The Queen is pregnant, and her actions in the next few weeks will do nothing less than shape the very foundations of any kingdom that survives her. The status of her heirs hangs in the balance.

A representative of the Bluestar who happens to be identical to Archonus Arendorr has offered you the Lichlord's aid, assuming that an agreement between his lord and your Queen can be reached. The terms are as of yet unexplored.

A representative of a rebellion against the Bluestar has appeared in Court, seeking aid from Archonus Bluestar, and failing that, from you.

A large portion of the army currently holding Oceanus has debarked for the Isle of Mourning, seeking two of the thirteen spiritblades that are somehow essential to Tain's plan.

Caer Albion is under siege, and on top of everything else, the people within have asked for your aid.

I've already noted how they're all linked together in an earlier post.

THE DEATHLANDS

As for a solution, I'd start with elimination of issues that cannot be dealt with simultaneously. The easiest pair of isses to focus on are the Bluestar/Rebellion angle. At face value, you're not going to be able to have your cake and eat it, too. You're probably going to have to pick one (although you might surprise me).

What can each side offer you?

The Bluestar can offer you the destruction of the Blades Tain needs, as well as a place to hide and protect the blades you do have in the mean time. He can offer you the use of at least one army you'll need to battle the forces directly and indirectly under his control, and he can presumably shed some light upon (and perhaps lift) the oath that prevents AB from helping you take care of another one of your problems - Jaine's pregnancy. But, even without the convenient husband angle, the Bluestar has a lot to offer you.

The rebellion can offer you troops, although not in numbers strong enough to take care of the Bluestar, let alone the hundreds of thousands currently arrayed against you. They *might* be able to hide the blades, and they *might* be able to destroy them. However, you have no evidence save hope of either.

As I see it, the only way to help the rebellion and get what you probably need most is to perform a double-blind con of extraordinary magnitude. It has been suggested elsewhere that part of a deal with the Bluestar would be offering to "take care" of his rebellion, by bringing them into your service. In fact, the best plan would be exactly the opposite. If what Jansten says is true, you'd be better off offering to take the Bluestar out of the Rebellion's path, at least for now.

Any of the Bluestar's forces working for you cannot be protecting the Bluestar or his interests. The more of his troops you can employ (and potentially expend) the better chances any rebellion in the North will have. In fact, while bringing down the ward would seem immediately disadvantageous to you, it probably couldn't hurt much, and would be more likely to result in the Bluestar's ultimate downfall than leaving him up there. In his realm, he is nearly a god. In yours, he is a powerful magician arrayed against forces you can hardly imagine. In a worst case scenario, you end up with one bad instead of two as he and Tain do battle. In a best case scenario, you end up with no bads, and a little clean up work. In all likelihood, the answer will be somewhere between, because regardless of the ultimate result, getting the Bluestar off of his power base will allow any rebellion a chance to solidify their hold on whatever they can gain before he returns (if he returns, at all).

But, if we have to pick one, pick the Bluestar, since he might be able to save us from annihilation. There's no way the Rebellion, no matter how powerful, can do that.

JAINE

If it were me, I'd make it brutally clear to Jaine that she's not likely to live through the birth of her children. A marriage to AB would probably cement an alliance with his faction, but that could have uncomfortable lasting consequences if the rebellion or Tain don't manage to eliminate Ol' Blue in the fighting. In all reality, her most realistic choices seem to be one of the two Archons, and despite the pricky political situation, she seems more likely to choose AB over AA, if only because she has been treated somewhat poorly. It's possible she could be returned to life after her children's birth, thus making the issue of which Archon she marries less problematic in a political sense, but more problematic in a personal one.

I see two decent options: Have her marry AA, and hope she stays dead. Or, Have her marry AB, but create a fictional (if believable) relationship between him and the real Archonus. The first option requires cooperation from no one but the fates. The second requires AB's duplicity, which requires you to deal with the Bluestar anyway, as in the idea for the North. In option 2, AB is King, Jaine is Queen, and AA is still the Marquis of Sylvanus, an important political bargaining chip in any post-war world. Either way will fit, but they result in very different political landscapes. This decision is not purely yours, but you can certainly support one or the other. Whatever happens, Jaine's marital status is an important bargainign tool, and any action taken should strengthen your relationship with AB, because....

THE ISLE OF MOURNING

Any force on the Isle will be dealing with at least 2 hostile factions. The Draconids will be in a race to find and capture the blades, while the Guardians will be fighting against your forces and the draconids to protect them. You cannot commit large numbers of your own troops without leaving Hyrwl and New Oceanus very vulnerable, so you must seek help from elsewhere.

The Bluestar's agreement and aid must be sought, for it is here that you hope to expend the lives and unlives of whatever troops he already has south of the Wall. With some of the Bluestar's troops this far south, you have given Jansten's rebellion a chance of success, at least for a time. Even if you do not succeed in getting the blades yourselves, opposing the actions of the serpentblood here can by you some much needed time, so that you can try to take care of....

CAER ALBION

Currently attack, the denizens of the capital have asked for your aid. This is a uniquely beneficial opportunity since it may allow you to acquire 2 spiritblades, as well as hold the Royal Capital under the phoneix banner. Committing at least some of your own troop is probably unavoidable, but acquiring mercenaries to aid in holding the city is probably an excellent idea. After determining how many will be needed for whatever plan you do develop to aid Caer Albion in particular, they need to be quickly hired, briefed, and magicked into the walls of the Capital. You have some spells at your disposal that might help, but since you should have acquired the Bluestar's agreements before moving on to this point, his mastery of the arcane might be able to help you move troops more quickly.

...

As you can see, all of the problems are tied together, and I just picked a place to start and started unravelling. This is far from the only way, and is probably not be the right way.

But, I thought it might help to see somebody walk through the process of prioritization and selection and see what we came up with. Almost all of the above are goals, with plans required to achieve them - but they are a unified set of goals, and that's the step you need to get to now. :)
 
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The first of my replies-- I'll get to everything eventually...

But, so far as Jaine goes... I think we can simply say that we have made it brutally clear that she will die in childbirth and explain to her the options she has. We will do what we can to bring her back-- if she chooses to come back with the "make out and bring her back to life" spell...

but, at this point, it is no longer something the PCs can control-- it is up to her... and, as such, up to the DM. (Unless AA does something incredible).
 

Queen_Dopplepopolis said:
The first of my replies-- I'll get to everything eventually...

But, so far as Jaine goes... I think we can simply say that we have made it brutally clear that she will die in childbirth and explain to her the options she has. We will do what we can to bring her back-- if she chooses to come back with the "make out and bring her back to life" spell...

but, at this point, it is no longer something the PCs can control-- it is up to her... and, as such, up to the DM. (Unless AA does something incredible).
That's fine. One of the things I do want to know, however, is which Jaine solution the group prefers? Assume she asked about what the Circle thinks the best path is...
 

The_Universe said:
That's fine. One of the things I do want to know, however, is which Jaine solution the group prefers? Assume she asked about what the Circle thinks the best path is...
The best solution is to have her marry AA or AB (under the correct terms, anyway) and hope with all hope that she makes it through the birthing process or that she can come back...

At least, that's what I think.
 
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And really, she should only marry AB if he's free of his oath to the bluestar. After all, if Jaine dies and doesn't come back, we don't want to lead a rebellion that is under the thumb of the lichlord.
 

Xath said:
And really, she should only marry AB if he's free of his oath to the bluestar. After all, if Jaine dies and doesn't come back, we don't want to lead a rebellion that is under the thumb of the lichlord.
I agree... (see my original post).

We need to have the "terms" of that marraige be free of Big Blue's control.... which is why, in a perfect work, AA would marry her... but, that's probably a lost cause. It would take an act of God to get her to marry him, now.

Maybe we just need to ask AB what happens if he breaks his oath.
 

Xath said:
we don't want to lead a rebellion that is under the thumb of the lichlord.
Just curious - what's the worst case scenario if AB does become king, and is still bound to the Bluestar. A best case?

What about the same for if he's released from his oath?

If the worst case is livable, it might be a a good option, regardless...

AB's loyalties only matter if you win the war in the first place.
 

Queen_Dopplepopolis said:
I agree... (see my original post).

We need to have the "terms" of that marraige be free of Big Blue's control.... which is why, in a perfect work, AA would marry her... but, that's probably a lost cause. It would take an act of God to get her to marry him, now.

Maybe we just need to ask AB what happens if he breaks his oath.
He won't break his Oath, because he understands the value of promises.

Also, because he is LN. But story-wise, it's the above.
 


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