D&D 4E Paizo and 4e.

[DandD]

D&D is still only a game. Making it anything more than it is is a sign that something isn't going well with you. That is true.
It's a game. That's it.

 

[tenkar]

Regardless of the specific example here, I think that some people need also to understand that for many people, D&D is much more than a game. Many gamers have played the game for decades. They've invested a lot of time and passion into it. They ran games. They painted minis. They drew maps. They created characters. Created, experimented, dreamed with the game.

That has NOTHING to do with them being "unrealistic", "overreacting", "creepy", "psychologically unbalanced" or anything else like that. They love the game. Plain and simple. And basically what's being told to them more and more is simply "who gives a flying f*** about your love for the game?! Go post elsewhere! Go play another game."

That kind of answer makes me sick.

Okay... don't take this the wrong way but it IS just a game. Just like WoW, EQ2, Lineage and all the computer games that hit the media on occassion when someone else loses their job or marriage because they are gaming for 3 days straight. To these people their game became an obsession.

It might be a game you truly enjoy, it might occupy a significant part of your life, but it IS just a game. The socialization that goes along with our hobby is more then a game, but in the end a game is just a game.

 

[Grog]

But surely, posting rants on message boards is certainly NOT the same thing as being suicidal, and is certainly NOT an indicator of whether someone is psychologically balanced or unbalanced.

Nor is posting an opinion about a new edition of D&D an indicator of whether someone is inhuman.

 

[Jim Hague]

We also all need to remember we're reading posts on a message boards. Not that they are irrelevant. Not that they make no sense. They do. But surely, posting rants on message boards is certainly NOT the same thing as being suicidal, and is certainly NOT an indicator of whether someone is psychologically balanced or unbalanced. Who do you think is overreacting or reading too much into someone else's post, in this instance?

Honestly? You are, Odhanan. You're using what is, at the very least, hyperbole, and at worst it's some pretty worrisome phrasing. You're pursuing the myth of the excluded middle here - people are not 'well' or 'ill', there are degrees. And to be brutally forthright here, I really do wonder about the mental stability of some people when they rant.

I can understand being upset, but going so far as to call it 'inhuman'? Ridiculous at best. If you feel like you're being tortured because of a new game edition, you need to walk away for a bit. The last thing this community needs is people degenerating into...what? Edition hooligans? And that goes for both sides.

 

[Odhanan]

Okay. Guys. I'm going to say this once: I'm a balanced individual. I wouldn't kill for D&D. I wouldn't sacrifice friendships or relationships for the game. So on, so forth.

You don't get what I mean here.

There's a huge difference between "D&D is more than a game" and "being obsessed about D&D". I'm not obsessed about D&D, but D&D is much more than a game to me. It's an outlet for different types of creativity and expression. It is tons of good memories. It's a source of learning (searching in encyclopedias to prepare this game, learning how to use this software to make a prop). Et cetera.

That's not being obsessed about the game. I'm just saying that the game, for many people like me, touches on many areas of their lives, hobbies, passions, whatever. If you can't see the difference between this acknowledgement and obsessive behavior, no wonder you're not getting people ranting on the boards...

PS: As for the whole "inhuman" thing. That's ONE word, for Pete's sake! And you're basically suspecting the guy is suicidal/unbalanced. If you believe that, you guys really need to take a break from the internet. Seriously.

 

[DaveMage]

That's not being obsessed about the game. I'm just saying that the game, for many people like me, touches on many areas of their lives, hobbies, passions, whatever. If you can't see the difference between this acknowledgement and obsessive behavior, no wonder you're not getting people ranting on the boards....

Yep.

It is a game. But for some of us, it's not *just* a game.

Monopoly (for me) is just a game. D&D has been a passion.

If it was "just a game" to us, we wouldn't really care about any of these discussions.

 

[Grog]

PS: As for the whole "inhuman" thing. That's ONE word, for Pete's sake! And you're basically suspecting the guy is suicidal/unbalanced. If you believe that, you guys really need to take a break from the internet. Seriously.

The only one I've seen use the word "suicidal" in this discussion so far is you.

 

[Jim Hague]

Okay. Guys. I'm going to say this once: I'm a balanced individual. I wouldn't kill for D&D. I wouldn't sacrifice friendships or relationships for the game. So on, so forth.

You don't get what I mean here.

There's a huge difference between "D&D is more than a game" and "being obsessed about D&D". I'm not obsessed about D&D, but D&D is much more than a game to me. It's an outlet for different types of creativity and expression. It is tons of good memories. It's a source of learning (searching in encyclopedias to prepare this game, learning how to use this software to make a prop). Et cetera.

That's not being obsessed about the game. I'm just saying that the game, for many people like me, touches on many areas of their lives, hobbies, passions, whatever. If you can't see the difference between this acknowledgement and obsessive behavior, no wonder you're not getting people ranting on the boards...

PS: As for the whole "inhuman" thing. That's ONE word, for Pete's sake! And you're basically suspecting the guy is suicidal/unbalanced. If you believe that, you guys really need to take a break from the internet. Seriously.

Passion is one thing. I have a passion for gaming - I have over 200 hand-painted minis in my collection, all used in gaming. Somewhere in the area of over $5000 in books, some extremely rare and out of print. I plan to be gaming until, frankly, I'm old and gray.

When someone acts as if it's a mortal offense to print a new edition of a book, using, yes, words like 'inhuman', go off on rants on messageboards (which are, by the fact that they are rants irrational and overtly emotional screeds), then they need to take a step back and seriously examine their priorities. Comparing a company that's making a new product to some sort of mad torturer of kittens and small children, of being 'corporate stooges'...that's not passion. That's at best ill-informed and at worst downright dumb.

 

[Shortman McLeod]

Indeed. I can truthfully say that 3e (and to a lesser extent 3.5) have been a financial investment on my part. One that I haven't fully realized the benefits of yet. That's a reason why I'm reluctant to update at this time.

But it's not been an emotional investment in the least.

Yep, there's nothing quite like cool, robotic detatchment from one's hobbies.

 

[GVDammerung]

There's a huge difference between "D&D is more than a game" and "being obsessed about D&D". I'm not obsessed about D&D, but D&D is much more than a game to me. It's an outlet for different types of creativity and expression. It is tons of good memories. It's a source of learning (searching in encyclopedias to prepare this game, learning how to use this software to make a prop). Et cetera.

That's not being obsessed about the game. I'm just saying that the game, for many people like me, touches on many areas of their lives, hobbies, passions, whatever. If you can't see the difference between this acknowledgement and obsessive behavior, no wonder you're not getting people ranting on the boards...

I get what you mean.

Gaming is an immersive hobby. For the DM, the immersion is creating, populating and presenting an entire fantasy world. For the player, the immersion is creating a character that consistently interacts with the world the DM is presenting. Both roles call for creativity and interaction in service to that creativity. Now take on those roles at a young age and continue for years and years. It is easy to see how D&D is "much more than a game" or put another way, it is easy for D&D to be more than a casual experience, unlike a game of Monopoly or Magic:tG. This is, in fact, one of the appeals of RPGs - they allow for more than a casual experience. Of course, you can play an RPG casually - the "beer and pretzels" style - but it is more common to see games taken with a bit more seriousness or commitment to the game play.

Anyone who doesn't get how D&D is or can be "much more than a game" is either not paying attention (put kindly), is being intentionally obtuse or has a limited or highly idiosyncratic (being kind again) experience, IMO.

Just to quantify a little bit how, for me, D&D is "much more than a game," I met my wife of now more than 15 years of happy marriage at a gaming table. I also met one of my oldest and best friends at a gaming table. Sure, D&D is a game but it has significant associations in my life that go well beyond the game. I know I am not alone in this.