Please rate the Lasher

[Hypersmurf]

The lasher can be in flanking position without making a melee attack.

Therefore, the lasher can, indeed, sneak attack, but not gain the +2 bonus.

Strictly speaking, the lasher only flanks the target while his ally is making a melee attack, which means that to Sneak Attack, he must Ready an action to attack at that time.

-Hyp.

 

[Relentless]

Indeed.

The primary point remains that a lasher can flank without receiving the bonus.

 

[Barcode]

The class is a great NPC class, or a good PC class if you are starting at a higher level. Surviving the low levels of suck that you must endure in order to prepare for this class is not easy or a lot of fun.

When my PC's were about fifth or sixth level, I threw an eighth level Fighter/Lasher at them. Mage Dispels Magic on the cool magical whip to suppress its magical properties. Cleric Shatters the whip. Villain runs to get his spare whip, and gets peppered with arrows and fireballs before becoming effective again. Very interesting combat, and demonstrative of the one-trick pony's Achilles Heel.

 

[Norfleet]

I'd say the class is interesting and not at all bad. The prerequisites are not loaded with useless or unfeasible skills and feats, and fills a niche role without being clearly overpowered. I could see people taking this.

 

[melkoriii]

Indeed.

The primary point remains that a lasher can flank without receiving the bonus.

I disagree.

The Whip is treated as a Melee weapon in two other instances.

Trip and Disarm as those two actions can only be done with melee weapons.

To get Sneak Attack you must flank an apponent.
Flanking is only with melee weapons, unless other wise stated in a Class or weapon as all other exceptions.

It is stated in the Lasher that it gets SA when Flanking and Flanking is a (You get it or you dont) and that would be all of it.

 

[LeifVignirsson]

I LOVE the Lasher, but then I am a HUGE Castlevania fan and I have always enjoyed seeing a whip used as a weapon. I have gone through and converted Richter Belmont using the Lasher as the main goal and it is as if it fits like a glove. However, that is also using a chain link whip with a morningstar at the end...

My opinion is Lashers are good if you want to accommodate it. If not, i can see where it might be a pain in the rear.

My other opinion is that the author has to be a big Belmont man, look at this PrC and then look at a Castlevania game... You will see the same thing (almost).

 

[Relentless]

The Whip is treated as a Melee weapon in two other instances.

Flanking is not one of those instances.

Trip and Disarm as those two actions can only be done with melee weapons.

As well as the whip, as per the item description.

This instance is an exception and is noted as such.

To get Sneak Attack you must flank an apponent.

Or when an opponent is denied his DEX bonus.

Flanking is only with melee weapons, unless other wise stated in a Class or weapon as all other exceptions.

Taken literally, this is not the case.

Refer to the PHB passage.

The lasher may threaten with his whip (as is implied).

This does not make the whip a melee weapon.

This does allow you to flank, but only the person with the melee weapon gains the bonus.

I repeat: Logic supports you if you give the lasher the bonus.

The rules, as written, do not.

It is stated in the Lasher that it gets SA when Flanking

I cannot find this text.

and Flanking is a (You get it or you dont) and that would be all of it.

Please clarify.

 

[melkoriii]

This does allow you to flank, but only the person with the melee weapon gains the bonus.

And the Errata for sword and fist says otherwise.

The rules, as written, do not.

And the Errata for sword and fist says otherwise.

I cannot find this text.

Read the Errata for Sword and Fist.

They add to the Lashers Sneak Attack discription to read after "Whether he has a Dex bonus ot not"
add
"or when the Lasher flanks the Target."

 

[Relentless]

I suggest you re-read the errata.

I never suggested the lasher could not sneak attack.

I did suggest that the lasher would not receive the +2 flanking bonus to hit.

The errata does not say anything to the contrary.

To repeat:

The lasher MAY FLANK, meaning to be in the flanking position.

As written, only the person wielding the melee weapon gains the +2 bonus.

 

[Ysgarran]

Getting a bit off-topic but...
10 minutes, PCGen:

Patukhar Gabrazel, Male Bugbear Humanoid3 Rogue2 Fighter2 Lasher5 CR 11; Size: M Type HUMANOID; HD (3d8)+(2d6)+(2d10)+(5d10)+36; hp 104; Init +4 (+4 Dex, +0 Misc); Spd Walk 30'; AC 23 (flatfooted 19, touch 14), *Whip +2 (+4 Mighty/Dagger/Flaming Burst) +17/+12 15'/S (1d6+8 19-20/x2 Primary S +1d6 fire damage, on a critical hit deals extra fire damage (+1d10)) or ; SA: Close combat, Crack of fate, Evasion (Ex), Lashing whip, Sneak Attack +1d6, Third hand, Whip lash, Whip sneak attack +2d6, Wound; Vision: Darkvision (60'), Normal AL: CE; Sv: Fort +8, Ref +14, Will +3; Str 21, Dex 18, Con 16, Int 14, Wis 12, Cha 6

Skills and Feats: Craft (Leatherworking) +4, Escape Artist +19, Hide +7, Jump +15, Listen +5, Spot +5, Tumble +12, Use Rope +11; Dodge, Exotic Weapon Proficiency, Expertise, Mobility, Spring Attack, Weapon Focus (Whip)
Possessions: 1 Chain Shirt +2 (DEX +2/Mithral), 1 Whip +2 (+4 Mighty/Dagger/Flaming Burst),

Now, if I wanted to spend some more time I'd double check the skill points and BAB. Other than that, not bad for a 10 minute character.

Ysgarran.

It's an example of how badly we need a character generator with a decent interface that knows all the rules. It took me, like, 2 hours to put Biter (as I named him) together. If there were an app that would let me just drag the race and classes (and PrCs) I want into place, and then tell me what requirements I'm not meeting and suggest classes to fix that, I'd pay $100 for that piece of software in a minute. So would the other 3 GMs in my group.