D&D 5E [poll] Druid Satisfaction Survey
- Thread starter Sacrosanct
- Start date
MechaTarrasque
Hero
I think the land druid is kind of dull--you look at a tundra and a swamp in the real world, and you would think the tundra magic guy and the swamp magic guy would be totally different, but in 5e, they are basically the same (minus a couple of spells). Nothing against the selection of terrain spells, but it is just too little.
I think instead of "wild shape focused" vs. "caster focused", they would have been better with a far roaming druid (like the moon druid) and a more place-specific druid. So a jungle druid could only turn into things in the jungle, but could turn into anything "native" to the jungle (that fit the CR requirements).
I think instead of "wild shape focused" vs. "caster focused", they would have been better with a far roaming druid (like the moon druid) and a more place-specific druid. So a jungle druid could only turn into things in the jungle, but could turn into anything "native" to the jungle (that fit the CR requirements).
pukunui
Legend
My biggest beef with the druid is the sheer number of spells that require concentration. I have yet to play a druid as a PC, but trying to use them as effective NPC antagonists is difficult. They can each only do one thing: flame blade or call lightning or flaming sphere or whatever ... and they can't have barkskin up at the same time. You really have to have multiple druids in the encounter if you want them to be a threat.
S
Sunseeker
Guest
I voted ambivalent, because when I think about my play of it as a class, that's how I feel. I didn't particularly enjoy playing, but I didn't dislike playing it either. I think it's just boring. The subclasses are poorly defined against each other, the Land druid is like 60% caster, 40% shifter and the Moon is the reverse. Not particularly defining. Plus, there are a startling lack of beast shapes and the caster doesn't really gain any special spells for being "more caster". The static abilities that the classes get are also pretty tame and not really anything to look forward to.
So, I may fall into dissatisfied because I just find it dull.
So, I may fall into dissatisfied because I just find it dull.
evolutionXXVII
First Post
I love playing a Druid, lots of unique role-play and the mix of spell casting and shape changing makes for very interesting tactical options in combat. They are computationally challenging if you don't like keeping track of your spells, minions, and the stats of the things you change into. For me that's part of the fun, but I can see why it's not for everyone.
Wild shape could use some work. Instead of getting 2/day and recovering one on a short rest, I think it would be better if you could get your druid level/3 worth of wild shape points. Points could then be spent wild shaping, with the cost equaling the beast's CR. This would both smooth the power curve of the moon druid and also open up some interesting RP options. You're not wasting a shape change by not changing into the most powerful shape possible. I think being able to freely change into level 0 creatures would make the class a lot more fun without imbalancing things, although this is obviously subject to debate.
Druidcraft (and all fluff cantrips) should explicitly become more powerful as the player levels, in line with damage cantrips. You should be able to predict the weather for 3 days, or create the sound of a medium animal. Maybe it should just be left up to the DM how to scale those cantrips, but something should be done to make them more fun to use.
Wild shape could use some work. Instead of getting 2/day and recovering one on a short rest, I think it would be better if you could get your druid level/3 worth of wild shape points. Points could then be spent wild shaping, with the cost equaling the beast's CR. This would both smooth the power curve of the moon druid and also open up some interesting RP options. You're not wasting a shape change by not changing into the most powerful shape possible. I think being able to freely change into level 0 creatures would make the class a lot more fun without imbalancing things, although this is obviously subject to debate.
Druidcraft (and all fluff cantrips) should explicitly become more powerful as the player levels, in line with damage cantrips. You should be able to predict the weather for 3 days, or create the sound of a medium animal. Maybe it should just be left up to the DM how to scale those cantrips, but something should be done to make them more fun to use.
Bitbrain
Lost in Dark Sun
The response to the 5e Druid has been very positive with my group.
The one guy playing as a Moon Druid in the secondary campaign absolutely loves alternating between Wild Shape in one fight, and then casting shillelagh on his club and whacking away with it in the next.
The Main DM has declared on multiple occasions that the 5e Druid is FAR better balanced that they were in 3.5, where he would outright ban them from his campaigns due to being (in his words) "Stupidly overpowered".
The one guy playing as a Moon Druid in the secondary campaign absolutely loves alternating between Wild Shape in one fight, and then casting shillelagh on his club and whacking away with it in the next.
The Main DM has declared on multiple occasions that the 5e Druid is FAR better balanced that they were in 3.5, where he would outright ban them from his campaigns due to being (in his words) "Stupidly overpowered".
I think the bones of the class are fine, but as some posters have mentioned above, here are the fundamental problems to solve with refinements:
1. There isn't enough difference in actual play between land druids and moon druids.
2. Moon druids scale in a very wonky fashion. Too strong at Lvl 2. Too weak at lvl 8/9. After Lvl 10, why change to any beast? (there are reasons, this is a superlative sentiment.)
3. Why is shape changing part of the core class? Is that really core to druid?
Here are my suggested fixes to refine the class.
Moon Druid
A. Moon druids only know a number a spells equal to their level + three. i.e. a 4th level moon druid knows seven spells.
B. Moon druids have a budget for wildshape equal to their level in CR per long rest. They can change into anything that has a CR equal to their level divided by 3. So brown bear at 3rd level.
C. Moon druids get the following ability at level 3.
Primal Fury- While in a wild shape form, as a bonus action you may consume a 2nd level spell slot to get a +2 bonus to saving throws, AC, and damage on attacks until your wild shape ends. You may use a higher level spell slot for an additional bonus. i.e. a 4th level spell slot gives the druid in that particular form a +4 bonus until they revert to caster form.
Land Druid
A. Land Druids have access to circle spells based on their current environment.
B. Land Druids get their wisdom bonus to Produce Flame cantrip damage at level 6, and their shillelah scales as other cantrips do. +1d8 at lvl 5, 11 and 17.
Also, I would implement a Shaman as a 3rd circle that is more martial, has control of animals/pets, buffs the area around them with animal spirits, but has more with limited access to wild shape and spells than the moon druid or land druid. In essence it would be a nature-based party buffer with reasonable martial abilities similar to the valor bard.
1. There isn't enough difference in actual play between land druids and moon druids.
2. Moon druids scale in a very wonky fashion. Too strong at Lvl 2. Too weak at lvl 8/9. After Lvl 10, why change to any beast? (there are reasons, this is a superlative sentiment.)
3. Why is shape changing part of the core class? Is that really core to druid?
Here are my suggested fixes to refine the class.
Moon Druid
A. Moon druids only know a number a spells equal to their level + three. i.e. a 4th level moon druid knows seven spells.
B. Moon druids have a budget for wildshape equal to their level in CR per long rest. They can change into anything that has a CR equal to their level divided by 3. So brown bear at 3rd level.
C. Moon druids get the following ability at level 3.
Primal Fury- While in a wild shape form, as a bonus action you may consume a 2nd level spell slot to get a +2 bonus to saving throws, AC, and damage on attacks until your wild shape ends. You may use a higher level spell slot for an additional bonus. i.e. a 4th level spell slot gives the druid in that particular form a +4 bonus until they revert to caster form.
Land Druid
A. Land Druids have access to circle spells based on their current environment.
B. Land Druids get their wisdom bonus to Produce Flame cantrip damage at level 6, and their shillelah scales as other cantrips do. +1d8 at lvl 5, 11 and 17.
Also, I would implement a Shaman as a 3rd circle that is more martial, has control of animals/pets, buffs the area around them with animal spirits, but has more with limited access to wild shape and spells than the moon druid or land druid. In essence it would be a nature-based party buffer with reasonable martial abilities similar to the valor bard.
evolutionXXVII
First Post
Great idea!
Sacrosanct
Legend
Obviously I'm not trying to discount your experience, because if this is what you've seen, it's what you've seen. But it struck me as a bit odd, because my experiences are different. IME, since land druids can't change into as powerful beasts, I've seen land druids act like nature priests who use wildshape to change in to utility animals (cats to sneak, dog to small, etc). Moon druids on the other hand, change into beasts for battle, and use spells to augment/heal that area. So for me, they play totally differently.
FormerlyHemlock
Hero
Moon druids at level 8 are strong because they can Polymorph into a T-Rex; they are strong at level 9 because they can now summon up a double-helping of wolves/whatever via Conjure Animals V, which is the best-scaling (and fastest) summoning spell in the whole game, or conjure up an Earth or Fire Elemental with Conjure Elemental. Plus, all the goodness from previous levels, such as Spike Growth (virtual Fireball), conjured Magma Mephits, Confusion crowd control, Speak With Plants/Plant Growth terrain manipulation, Wall of Fire, Call Lightning, Entangle, ultra-sneaky Pass Without Trace (+10 to Stealth = surprise = virtual Action Surge for everyone in the party), etc.
Moon Druids are never weak at any point. (And no, Level 1 doesn't count because they're not Moon Druids until level 2.
)The following observation is based on mock runs, not actual play, but I think it is still valid:
The biggest difference between Moon and Land Druid wildshape, pre-level 10, is the action economy. Moon Druids can cast a spell (e.g. Spike Growth) and THEN ALSO wildshape (e.g. into a Giant Constrictor Snake). Land Druids can cast a spell OR wildshape into a slightly weaker animal. Overall however, the difference between a CR 1 animal (Giant Toad) and a CR 2 or CR 3 animal (Rhinoceros, Giant Scorpion) is not that big. A 8th level Land Druid who wildshapes into an AC 11, 39 HP Giant Toad to restrain the hobgoblin warlord isn't quite as tough as an 8th level Moon Druid who wildshapes into an AC 12, 60 HP Giant Constrictor Snake... but in both cases, the hobgoblin warlord is going to get beat up pretty thoroughly at advantage by everyone in the party, while being at disadvantage on his own attacks.
Also, the nice thing about wildshape being a short rest ability is that anyone, including a Moon Druid, can afford to wildshape into utility animals. That I have seen in actual play.
Anyway, IMO, if you're a land druid who never wildshapes for combat purposes, you're leaving utility and free HP on the table. 36 free HP per short of Giant Frog (or Black Bear, or whatever) is still 36 free HP per short rest.
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