Powergaming w/ Awaken: I have +2 HD!

[Creamsteak]

If a druid wanted to transform and then awaken himself (by whatever means he has available), that's fine. I've got no problem whatsoever with giving a druid a multiple personality disorder (one of which being that of the 'awakened animal' obviously).

That's how I'd probably handle it at least.

 

[Rozman]

but this could be bypassed by having the Druid at 16th level, and thus being able to wildshape into a Plant creature, which have no Intelligence limitations.

Slim

"Plant" is not a valid target for the spell, only tree or animal, and the Druid can't wild-shape into a non-creature plant.


Also, if you were to allow the druid to cast it on himself, would he have to succeed at 1 Saving Throw and fail another?

"To succeed, you must make a Will save (DC 10 + the animal's current HD, or the HD the tree will have once awakened.)"

"Saving Throw: Will negates"

The Caster has to make a Saving Throw, and the Target has to fail a saving throw.

And another example in the chain of "does changing the target to an invalid type negate the spell:"
Animate Plants on a tree.
Polymorph Any Object on the tree and turn it into a rock.
Is it still Animated? Does it make a difference if you just turn it into a different tree? Or perhaps into a wooden object?

[Edit: Entirely mis-worded the Saving Throw portion.]

 

[Darkness]

I also think that, if the druid again wildshaped into Animal later, he'd instead be a Magical Beast again (since awaken is a permanent effect that turns an Animal into a Magical Beast).

Heh. I forgot to mention the point of this statement.
That is, that you can't awaken him again. 'cause he already is a Magical Beast.

YMMV, but it makes sense to me, at least.

 

[Deset Gled]

Also, if you were to allow the druid to cast it on himself, would he have to succeed at 1 Saving Throw and fail another?

He would have to make the will save to cast it, but could voluntarily fail the will save to negate the effects.

 

[Caliban]

It seems to be legal by a strict reading of the rules, but is also obviously against the spirit of the rules. (And I don't accept the "we can't really know the intent" theory, so don't start.)

I would just rule that a druid that polymorphs into an Animal actually has the Magical Beast type, not the Animal type. He's too intelligent, and he has magical abilities. (As Darkness stated.)

 

[Hypersmurf]

I would just rule that a druid that polymorphs into an Animal actually has the Magical Beast type, not the Animal type. He's too intelligent, and he has magical abilities. (As Darkness stated.)

Weren't things so much neater when you retained your type?

-Hyp.

 

[Norfleet]

Weren't things so much neater when you didn't need rules like this for "type" and whatnot, because any DM worth his salt would know to slap something like this down, and the player who proposed it silly? Back when there weren't rules like this to be argued, people who proposed something like this got pelted with dice. Now that they have some nebulous and undoubtedly poorly-worded rule backing them up, they actually have a leg to stand on. Sad.

 

[takyris]

Dumb question: If you wildshape into a bear, can someone cast Repel/Charm/Invisibility to Animals on you?

If so, then that would seem to imply that you could do it.

Except for the "not functioning on Int>=3 creatures" part, which is why you should only do it on druids who have been hit by Feeblemind spells first.

 

[isoChron]

Why, oh why can't they use a clearly stated wildshape like the one they had in MotW ? Why always this silly connection to polymorph ??? Wildshape and polymorph are different and so there is no problem with animal type or whatever. Do you loose your INT because you become an animal ? If not, why are you called an animal ? ..... Brrrrrrr

BYE

 

[Pielorinho]

Caliban, it's reasonable to rule that a wildshaped druid is a magical beast -- but that's specifically against the rules, which state that you assume the creature type of your new form.

Darkness's argument is interesting, but fails on the same point. The spell's target's type works as follows:

1) Pre-baleful-polymorph: humanoid (or whatever)
2) Baleful-polymorph: animal.
3) Awaken: magical beast.
4) Baleful-polymorph: animal
5) Awaken: magical beast.
6...) See steps 2-5.
End) Dispel magic on baleful polymorph: humanoid (or whatever)

Both baleful polymorph and wildshape change the creature's type; its previous type is immaterial to this change.

Indeed, this was one of the examples I used to convince my DM to use the perfectly fine Wildshape rules from MotW, with a few modifications to account for a druid's new ability to wildshape into plants.

Daniel