Quicker than the Eye, Unbalanced?

[Lord Vangarel]

One of the players in our group chose the Quicker than the Eye feat last night and maxed out his Bluff skill. The feat allows a Bluff check each round to allow an extra partial action against the bluffed opponent which if successful can be used as a sneak attack. The upshot of this was that the rogue was getting a sneak attack attempt almost every round.

Is this unbalanced?

One solution I have thought of is the feat is either a Move Equivalent action or a Standard Action which will limit what else the character can do that round.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

I believe the prerequisites are quite harsh.

You should perhaps throw some opponents at the group that are not so easily sneaked.
(Elementals, Skeletons and several other ones)
If you use human enemies, give them the Sense Motive Skill (rogues or bards are good in these things)

Think about those "Armor of Fortification" enhancements. They allow you to negate Sneak Attacks and Critical hits.
Let Wizards use the Blur Spell (concealment can easily negate sneak attacks).
Let a cleric cast Hold Monster on the Rogue

Mustrum Ridcully

 

[Plane Sailing]

Does the feat say anything that limits its use against a target (or limits the size of weapon which it can be used with?) The latter wouldn't make a big difference I'll admit, but perhaps the former would - because you can zap them once, but catching them off guard in the same way twice should be more difficult?

I don't have Song & Silence, so I can't be precise.

BTW - does it have to be countered by a Sense Motive or by a Spot check? Many creatures have much better spot checks.

 

[Crothian]

Unfortuantely the feat is not written properly. This is copied from the Wizards boards. The person is not me but whomever wrote it:

Person: Here's a clarification from the Sage I got in an email:

Person: 5. I found Quicker Than the Eye confusing. Do you get an actual extra partial action granted to you if *any* foe (even 1 out of 20 goblins) fails
the Spot check?

Sage: No. Creatures that fail their spot checks just don't see what you're doing for the rest of the round.
Comment:I never brought up Haste, so do not assume his comment means that this includes the extra action you get from Haste. He simply answered my question.

Person: 6. Or, is this feat meant to just allow you to make one attack after
bluffing in the same round?

Sage: No, you can do just about anything after the bluff.

Person: 7. For instance, can these moves be done:

Person: a) make a melee attack, bluff, and attack again if successful (failed checks lose dex bonus)?

Sage: No.

Person: b) bluff, move 30', and attack if successful (failed checks lose dex bonus)?

Sage: No.

Person: c) bluff, attack (or drink potion, move, etc.) if successful (failed checks lose dex bonus)?

Sage: Yes.

Person: 8. If everyone makes their Spot checks, the rogue could still take a partial action, but everyone retains their dex bonus...is this correct?

Sage: Yes (or everyone sees whatever it is that you're doing for the rest of the round).

Person: 9. If not, a failed bluff results in no further action in the round (assuming no Haste)...is this right?

Sage: No, see previous answer.

Skip Williams
RPG R&D

 

[Lord Vangarel]

The prerequisites is a Dexterity of 19. There is nothing in the description of the feat limiting its use against opponents and I don't want to use the easy approach of most opponents don't allow Sneak attacks against them.

What I'm hoping for is an official correction if it exists, or the best solution people may have come up with. The feat is countered by a Spot check but this character will rightly keep his Bluff skill maxed out for using this feat.

 

[Lord Vangarel]

Crothian

This would seem to indicate that the use of the feat is a Standard Action which is what I was leaning towards anyway.

I think the following should be added to the feat description:

Use of this feat is a Standard Action so the rogue could Move, Bluff, and Attack (if the Bluff is successful then the attack can be a Sneak Attack), but could not Attack, Bluff, and Attack again with the feat.

What does everyone else think?

 

[Darklone]

Yeah.

I read somewhere another Sage answer about it and it was kinda this:

QttE allows to bluff as ME action (just as the gladiator ability). Nothing else, nothing less. The prerequs are ok for that one. That partial action stuff is crap, it simply should have meant that you make a Standard action (ME plus attack) and the ME is a bluff attempt. No additional partial action.

 

[Thanee]

While taking a standard action you can make a move-equivalent action to use QttE. Whoever gets distracted does not see what you do during your standard action and loses his Dex bonus to AC, if you attack him.

No extra action gained.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Darklone]

While taking a standard action you can make a move-equivalent action to use QttE. Whoever gets distracted does not see what you do during your standard action and loses his Dex bonus to AC, if you attack him.

No extra action gained.

Bye
Thanee

Thanks for agreeing AND explaining it better

 

[Bobbystopholes]

It is a Move-Equivelant, which means you bluff instead of move, then attack or run away. Essentially, it's a full round action like when a 6-th level fighter has a base-attack bonus of +6/+1. You just get one attack (or run . That means you have to be standing right next to that person for at least one round to get a "free" sneak attack, possibly getting hit really, really hard by that High -level Fighter. I don't think a normal rogue wouldn't want to put themselves in that position!

The way I see it, the only way you can bluff, move, and attack is if you do a partial charge, lowering your AC when that ticked off opponent turns from his original target and hits you.

No way is this over-powered.