Real world myths and legends: Who's Epic Level?

[Upper_Krust]

Hi Colonel Hardisson mate!

Thought I'd post a fun little topic, just to help ease the tension today. Please, let's limit our discussion to anything that isn't from one of the top three major religions - I don't want to sound draconian, but I'm hoping this won't turn into a flame war.

So, what heroes from myth and legend seem to be of Epic level to you? By Epic level, I mean in the D&D sense - above 20th level, and with powers and abilities that are beyond those of the 20th level and below D&D characters. Here are my lists, to get started:

Epic level:

Achilles
Lancelot
Cu Chulainn
Hercules (yeah, I know he's in Deities & Demigods, but indulge me).

One parameter that might prove useful in this discussion is determining the greatest mortal hero of each mythos (what do the rest of you think!?)

My suggestions would be (off the top of my head):

Amerindian = Hiawatha
Babylo-Sumerian = Gilgamesh
Celtic = CuChulainn
Egyptian = Imhotep
Finnish = Vainamoinen
Greek = Odysseus
Norse = Beowulf
Persian = Rustem

 

[S'mon]

Thought I'd post a fun little topic, just to help ease the tension today. Please, let's limit our discussion to anything that isn't from one of the top three major religions - I don't want to sound draconian, but I'm hoping this won't turn into a flame war.

So, what heroes from myth and legend seem to be of Epic level to you? By Epic level, I mean in the D&D sense - above 20th level, and with powers and abilities that are beyond those of the 20th level and below D&D characters. Here are my lists, to get started:

Epic level:

Achilles
Lancelot
Cu Chulainn
Hercules (yeah, I know he's in Deities & Demigods, but indulge me)

Cuchulainn, Hercules & Gilgamesh I agree with, Achilles just had a munchkin player!
Can't think of others offhand - the power gradient in D&D is so steep that few mythological heroes could not be accounted for in the first 20 levels. Certainly I don't see Lancelot over about 18th.

 

[ColonelHardisson]

So?

To expand a bit: yes, I know. The fact that "epic level" can be arbitrarily defined as pertaining to characters with more than 20 levels of advancement doesn't make any difference. Trying to match up characters from myth, legend, history, or wherever, to an arbitrary scale of advancement is an exercise akin to counting how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

Look, I was hoping this would be more of a lighthearted discussion of everyone's perceptions of heroes and other characters from literature, myth, and legend. I set the basic criteria for just that purpose. If you don't like that premise, that's OK. But that's my premise, and I'm sticking to it. For the purposes of this thread, philosophical discussions of why that premise doesn't work don't really interest me. Not that the subject itself isn't interesting, but it's kind of like saying "you shouldn't post this thread or discuss this topic." I simply wanted to discuss this exact subject, not debate the premise.

 

[Frostmarrow]

All that this really means is that you don't have to be 21st level to save the world.

Wow. You read my entire post, hit the quote button, waited for the page to load and cut out parts of it in your reply in less than 2 minutes and still managed to find an argument to topple all I've said so far. I'm truly impressed.

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

I thought you meant the really REAL world, in which case I was going to say, the myth, the legend: Michael Jordan.

(And Ditka.)


Wulf

 

[ColonelHardisson]

Re: Re: Real world myths and legends: Who's Epic Level?

Hi Colonel Hardisson mate!



One parameter that might prove useful in this discussion is determining the greatest mortal hero of each mythos (what do the rest of you think!?)

My suggestions would be (off the top of my head):

Amerindian = Hiawatha
Babylo-Sumerian = Gilgamesh
Celtic = CuChulainn
Egyptian = Imhotep
Finnish = Vainamoinen
Greek = Odysseus
Norse = Beowulf
Persian = Rustem

The only one I'd debate is Odysseus. I never saw any evidence that he could do anything that a 20th level and below character could not do. Achilles seemingly could do things that nobody else could do. Not that fighting prowess is the only criterion, but he was just so much better than everyone else he'd be the obvious choice for me.

 

[S'mon]

Re: Re: Real world myths and legends: Who's Epic Level?

Hi Colonel Hardisson mate!



One parameter that might prove useful in this discussion is determining the greatest mortal hero of each mythos (what do the rest of you think!?)

My suggestions would be (off the top of my head):

Amerindian = Hiawatha
Babylo-Sumerian = Gilgamesh
Celtic = CuChulainn
Egyptian = Imhotep
Finnish = Vainamoinen
Greek = Odysseus
Norse = Beowulf
Persian = Rustem

Hi Craig - yes, I think that's a more useful exercise.

For Greek, the greatest hero is Hercules (being half-god didn't stop you being a hero in Greek mythos), although Ulysses is my favourite I can't see him winning a fight against some fairly obscure heroes like Diomedes (who beat Ares).

For Norse, it's got to be Sigurd the Dragonslayer - he killed his dragon and lived! Beowulf is cool but he was clearly outclassed.
Oh, and:

American mythos - Superman
British mythos - James Bond

 

[ColonelHardisson]

Re: Re: Re: Real world myths and legends: Who's Epic Level?

Hi Craig - yes, I think that's a more useful exercise.

I wasn't intending this to be useful or an exercise. Nothing wrong with either, but...

This isn't nearly as fun as I'd hoped.

 

[S'mon]

Re: Re: Re: Real world myths and legends: Who's Epic Level?

Re real-world heroes, I'm surprised no Americans have mentioned Sergeant Rock.

 

[hong]

Wow. You read my entire post, hit the quote button, waited for the page to load and cut out parts of it in your reply in less than 2 minutes and still managed to find an argument to topple all I've said so far. I'm truly impressed.

It's a gift I have.