Mind of tempest
(he/him)advocate for 5e psionics
what do you mean by heroic?
D&D General Rebuilding a new monk (+)
- Thread starter CreamCloud0
- Start date
Tier 3 characters basically.
So a tier 3 Fighter might be an Arcane Archer. At least that us my current thinking.
I want Monk class features to ADD resources. I credit Treantmonk for summarizing it, but whenever almost any other class gains a new feature, it adds a resource to use them. Gain spellcasting? You also gain limited spell slots to use that feature. Gain something like action surge, form of dread, war priest attacks, or psionic energy dice? They each add limited uses.
The Monk plunders its own resources. It has so many abilities that all draw from the same pool, then you add Archetypes that often increase that drain. It's like a Rogue that can't use Sneak Attack after too much Cunning Action. Whatever changes are done to the Monk, whatever wins in the polls, this fundamental design issue needs to be corrected.
The Monk plunders its own resources. It has so many abilities that all draw from the same pool, then you add Archetypes that often increase that drain. It's like a Rogue that can't use Sneak Attack after too much Cunning Action. Whatever changes are done to the Monk, whatever wins in the polls, this fundamental design issue needs to be corrected.
There really should be multiple versions of Martial Arts, one for each Ability score combination and Role
- Astral Style
- Scores: Wis/Con
- Role: Striker/Support
- Bonus: Can use Wisdom instead of Strength for the attack and damage rolls of your unarmed strikes and monk weapons.
- Fire Style
- Scores: Dex/Cha
- Role: Damage Dealer
- Bonus: Add Cha to unarmed damage
- Iron and Stone Style:
- Scores: Dex/Str
- Role: Tank
- Bonus: Add Str to AC
- Water and Wind Style:
- Scores: Dex/Wis
- Role: Striker/Tank
- Bonus: Can take Dodge action and make single unarmed or monk weapon attack as bonus action
DND_Reborn
The High Aldwin
What if Monk became a subclass of Fighter, as an unarmed / martial artist warrior, and then all the other "monk" concepts could be some sort of Mystic or made into subclasses for other classes???
There seems to be SO much variation in what people want from the Monk, I just can't see how a single class could incorporate it all and be viable.
There seems to be SO much variation in what people want from the Monk, I just can't see how a single class could incorporate it all and be viable.
The basics of a Monk has too many mechanical aspects. I mean look at the poll. Even if you choose 4 of them, that 4 features you have to grant in 1 level.
That's why "Class as Subclass of Fighter" never works except for people who never were going to play the class anyway.
jmartkdr2
Hero
After reading a thread about expanding the use of martial maneuvers, it occured to me that monks, not fighters, should be the ultimate "full-maneuver" class. Fighters add maneuvers to a solid base, monks should be all-in on maneuvers as how they get things done. More dice, more maneuvers known, etc.
But following from that - maneuvers should include both magical and nonmagical options, both fueled by what they call ki. I'd even use maneuvers as the basis for psionics.
Edit: a couple other notes: stances are a type of maneuver, the equivalent to concentration spells. They provide a bonus (or two) while in the stance but you can only be in one at a time. Unlike concentration, damage doesn't make you roll to keep the stance (though extreme distruptions might do so.)
Monks, being all about the perfection of the self, should have more ASIs than anyone else, even fighters. I don't mind them being a bit MAD, but they should be able to afford it.
In addition to psionics and ki being the same resource as superiority dice, I also would like bardic inspiration to be fully fungible with them. This does create a weird mechanical space for inspiring monks and/or makes bard/monks an oddly powerful multiclass, but I don't know how to flavor that quite yet.
But following from that - maneuvers should include both magical and nonmagical options, both fueled by what they call ki. I'd even use maneuvers as the basis for psionics.
Edit: a couple other notes: stances are a type of maneuver, the equivalent to concentration spells. They provide a bonus (or two) while in the stance but you can only be in one at a time. Unlike concentration, damage doesn't make you roll to keep the stance (though extreme distruptions might do so.)
Monks, being all about the perfection of the self, should have more ASIs than anyone else, even fighters. I don't mind them being a bit MAD, but they should be able to afford it.
In addition to psionics and ki being the same resource as superiority dice, I also would like bardic inspiration to be fully fungible with them. This does create a weird mechanical space for inspiring monks and/or makes bard/monks an oddly powerful multiclass, but I don't know how to flavor that quite yet.
Take a look at the A5e Adept. It solves part of the problem, at least, through Focus Features and Practiced Techniques. Practiced Techniques are all about movement/spiritualism/out of combat stuff, and then Focus Features are all about hitting or defending.
Then you put your fancy wire-fu ki-tricks in there with hard-hitting not-fancy brawler stuff and let people construct their personal Martial Artist with as much or as little wire-fu as they like.
Adept | Level Up
a5e.tools
The only arguably "Magic" thing the Adept class has tied into the leveling structure itself is Empty Mind. And it could just as easily be interpreted as "Stonefaced and Stubborn" as "Willful and Disciplined"
Another way is to have 3-4 Core classes.
Option 1: Fighter (Warrior), Mage, Rogue
Then Archetypes are further subdivisions, and Heroic (Tier 3) possess magic. Mage would include Clerics.
Option 2: Faith, Fighter, Mage, Rogue.
Faith would cover Priests, Healers, Clerics, and Paladin.
Option 3: Strip out classes and make it all bespoke which could make too many choices like in 4e.
Helldritch
Hero
Personnaly, the monk as is function quite OK in my games. The only thing we added was wisdom bonuses to ki. That said.
The monk could be improved.
Adding a third action attack at level 13 and a third attack on flurry at level 17 would keep the monk on a good spot with the fighter.
A transformation we do consider is to transform the monk into a long rest class as the other martial types. Things could be going this way.
1) Flurry do not cost Ki.
2) Instead of dodging costing both a Ki and the action bonus, use a new skill, parry. At the cost of its reaction and a Ki point, the monk gains +4 AC until the start of its next turn
3) All ki are multiplied by three and are restored on long rest. Doing this would mean no ki for wisdom bonus. Thus not using ki on Flurry in 1.
4) increase the martial art die by one factor. D4 to d6, d6 to d8 and so on. The fact that TCoE made unarmed fighting style better that what the monk is doing is pure BS and a clear lack of respect for the class.
5) Add two more feats at level 6 and 10.
6) Allow monk to use weapons doing their Martial art die or their original damage of better from the get go. Adding more "monkish" weapon would also help. Kusarigama are really good weapons and fit the monk's theme but are absent of the PHB. It's a shame that so many martial art weapons are absent from the game when the monk is in the base game. This is an almost unforgivable oversight.
7) Add more feats that could fit the monk's theme. So far, mo k is the only class that benefits truly from only two or three feats and even then, because the monk is so MAD most players will not choose feat for their character until both de and wis are at 20. Only exception is the Mobile feat which all monks are taking. Even delaying ASI just to get it. Being able to add 10 feet and disengage on attacked target is too good an opportunity for the monk to pass on. The second most taken feat is tough... usually before starting pumping wisdom.
And that is about it. But I fear the class would become too strong. Or maybe not...
The monk could be improved.
Adding a third action attack at level 13 and a third attack on flurry at level 17 would keep the monk on a good spot with the fighter.
A transformation we do consider is to transform the monk into a long rest class as the other martial types. Things could be going this way.
1) Flurry do not cost Ki.
2) Instead of dodging costing both a Ki and the action bonus, use a new skill, parry. At the cost of its reaction and a Ki point, the monk gains +4 AC until the start of its next turn
3) All ki are multiplied by three and are restored on long rest. Doing this would mean no ki for wisdom bonus. Thus not using ki on Flurry in 1.
4) increase the martial art die by one factor. D4 to d6, d6 to d8 and so on. The fact that TCoE made unarmed fighting style better that what the monk is doing is pure BS and a clear lack of respect for the class.
5) Add two more feats at level 6 and 10.
6) Allow monk to use weapons doing their Martial art die or their original damage of better from the get go. Adding more "monkish" weapon would also help. Kusarigama are really good weapons and fit the monk's theme but are absent of the PHB. It's a shame that so many martial art weapons are absent from the game when the monk is in the base game. This is an almost unforgivable oversight.
7) Add more feats that could fit the monk's theme. So far, mo k is the only class that benefits truly from only two or three feats and even then, because the monk is so MAD most players will not choose feat for their character until both de and wis are at 20. Only exception is the Mobile feat which all monks are taking. Even delaying ASI just to get it. Being able to add 10 feet and disengage on attacked target is too good an opportunity for the monk to pass on. The second most taken feat is tough... usually before starting pumping wisdom.
And that is about it. But I fear the class would become too strong. Or maybe not...
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