Rule Clarifications

[Hypersmurf]

Yes. The power is an acid effect. But this doesn't mean the acid damage is an effect of that, err, effect...

A phantom steed is immune to any effect other than damage.

-Hyp.

 

[Gruns]

Well...

Immunity cares about Keywords, resistance cares about damage types. Keywords are only selective on effects if they explicitly say so. Otherwise, there's no 'This is this, and that is that.'

Here's an example why it can't be selective. Let's say you have a power:

Dynophobia
Encounter - Arcane, Thunder, Fear, Implement.
Ranged 10
Attack: Intellegence vs Fortitude
Hit: Target takes 2d10 thunder damage, is pushed a number of squares equal to your wisdom modifier, and is immobilized (save ends)

Now... which part is the fear part, which part is the thunder?

The thunder damage is obviously 'thunder' by your interpretation, but what about the push? Both thunder powers and fear powers have push effects as part of their milieu.

I don't think anyone is really confused by this. The Effect takes on all of the keywords of the power and would be stopped by Immunity to either Arcane, Thunder, Fear or Implement. (Yes, I'm aware that two of those immunites don't exist and likely never will).

Even with a power such as this where it's easy to differentiate what "type" an effect is:
Icy Thunder
Encounter - Arcane, Cold, Implement, Thunder.
Ranged 10
Attack: Intellegence vs Fortitude
Hit: Target takes 2d10 cold and thunder damage, is pushed 2 squares and is slowed(save ends)
It'd be safe to conclude that the push effect is from the thunder and the slowed is from the cold, but since they aren't typed, immunity to cold or thunder stops both the push effect and the slow effect. (Consequently, in this case all of the damage would be stopped as well with immunity to either keyword.)

But let's say thunder is restricted to damage only... then wouldn't feats or items that increase the number of squares of pushing a thunder effect does be useless?

No... The power is still a Thunder effect, due to the Thunder keyword. Again, this is stuff that seemingly no one is confused by.

See, it -can't- work that way, because there's too many holes, and the rules give zero guidelines on how to even begin to adjudicate it.

It's messy, and puts too much in the hands of the DM to interpret without -any guidance what-so-ever.-

You cannot interpret the rule that way without inventing rules of your own to cover the holes, therefore, it cannot be the rule.

I think you're intentionally making this more confusing that it really needs to be...

Later!
Gruns

 

[N8Ball]

You are the man, Cran! Thanks for the legwork.

Part 2 on mixed damage is still a little counter intuitive to me since an attack that did Fire, cold, electricity, poison, and acid (mixed) would do FULL damage to a creature with Resist 40 cold electricity, poison AND acid (no resist to fire), but ZERO damage to a creature simply immune to fire and none of the other types.

Still, I think the ruling is pretty fair. The 28th level Efreet Karadjin will be pleased to know they can again do some damage to the (15th level) Immolith that gets out of line (since all his powers have the Fire keyword and the Immolith is immune to fire.) since the untyped damage of his powers will still hurt.

There are still parts I would write different, but given that it is an official opinion on the subject, I can get behind the ruling as that will be a pretty rare case anyway.