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5E Running Rime of the Frost Maiden


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Scott Christian

Adventurer
Thank you.

And wow, this is BAD


or


ugh
No offense, but if all DM's were as unimaginative and needed to be spoon fed as the one you quoted, all adventures (all movies, all RPG's, all tv shows, all books, all stories told around a campfire) would be full of plot holes. And to be even more fair, you are talking about an adventure that is TWO pages long. But yeah, let's find the plot holes. :oops:

Two things: Suspension of disbelief and reading the nuance.

Hlin followed the caravan for ten days... from town to town. Eventually she had stop. Why? Maybe she felt they were getting suspicious. Maybe she was running low on coin and needed to replenish her purse from home. Maybe she realized she wouldn't be able to take out the killer, Sephek, so instead waits to find someone that can.

And laughable say-so? Three people have been murdered. Live in a town of 150 and have someone murdered and see if the "veteran bounty hunter who has honed skills throughout her years" isn't viewed as a good investigator. Attach that to her noticing Sephek's ability to not be cold during a time of a magically prolonged winter and things can add up.
 




robus

Lowcountry Low Roller
Supporter
Was there a time you thought Wizards (or TSR) had a superior level of design quality for their adventures that they aren't reaching anymore?
For me, I just assumed that after 50 years of adventure creation it would be down to a fine art for professionals in the business. But apparently it's still kind of hit and miss.

Edit: for example, the fact that they don't even bother to tag encounters with the expected difficulty or give some guide to the adventuring day break down of the adventure, shows they give little thought to the DMs trying to run these damn things. And that's just some basic info they could easily provide.
 

Reynard

Legend
What’s worse is all the posters I see not only defending this product, and in some cases, enthusiastically praising it.

This is why we won’t see advances in the design quality coming out of WITC anytime soon.
Well since this one guy on Twitter hates it, we should all shred our copies...

It's totally okay to not like a thing, and to exalt a particular reviewer's opinions. But when those combine to create a false sense of objective fact, it makes people look pretty silly.
 

robus

Lowcountry Low Roller
Supporter
Well since this one guy on Twitter hates it, we should all shred our copies...

It's totally okay to not like a thing, and to exalt a particular reviewer's opinions. But when those combine to create a false sense of objective fact, it makes people look pretty silly.
Well it’s not like WotC doesn’t have a history of producing hare-brained adventures for 5e... so I’d say it‘s fair enough to assume this likely follows the pattern. And sorry if there are some of us who expect more from this publisher.
 

Ancalagon

Dusty Dragon
Well since this one guy on Twitter hates it, we should all shred our copies...

It's totally okay to not like a thing, and to exalt a particular reviewer's opinions. But when those combine to create a false sense of objective fact, it makes people look pretty silly.
The Alexandrian isn't just "some guy". He's an award-winning blogger who's given a lot of thought on how adventures work, what makes them function etc.

He's also published pretty thorough fixes for a number of WotC adventures, and they are pretty good at fixing the structural problems of these scenarios.


for example: Dragon Heist Remix – Part 1: The Villains

edit: So this is why, earlier in this thread, I recommended waiting for his fixes to be published.
 

Check out his thoughts on Velynne Harpell.

He pointed out there’s a section in the adventure where she gets plot armor and can’t be killed due to her importance to the adventure.

He also comments on the ridiculousness of expecting players not to immediately attack an obvious necromancer.

Why would players attack an obvious necromancer?

Unless they want to get arrested for murder.

What are they, psychopaths?
 

Wasteland Knight

Adventurer
Well it’s not like WotC doesn’t have a history of producing hare-brained adventures for 5e... so I’d say it‘s fair enough to assume this likely follows the pattern. And sorry if there are some of us who expect more from this publisher.
I totally agree except for the bolded part. I'm not sorry one bit.
 

DEFCON 1

Legend
Supporter
What other publishers are producing adventure path books of this size do you think are hands-down better than WotC's? What lessons and examples should WotC be taking from?
 

robus

Lowcountry Low Roller
Supporter
What other publishers are producing adventure path books of this size do you think are hands-down better than WotC's? What lessons and examples should WotC be taking from?
I've heard good things about Paizo's efforts. People seem to have high praise for Rise of the Runelords for example. But I've not run them.

But I'd also say that just because everyone is probably doing a poor job, doesn't mean WotC could be doing a better job :) - they are the 800lb gorilla in the RPG space after all.

I guess I don't understand why the state of the art hasn't gotten better after all these years. At least I don't understand why obviously useful information for DMs is not included (like encounter difficulty expectations etc - which I believe is an aspect of Paizo's offerings?).
 

Check out his thoughts on Velynne Harpell.

He pointed out there’s a section in the adventure where she gets plot armor and can’t be killed due to her importance to the adventure.

He also comments on the ridiculousness of expecting players not to immediately attack an obvious necromancer.
Maybe someone should comment on the ridiculousness of killing the person offering to help when your home is under attack by a dragon?

Actually, if the players are homicidal maniacs who are stupid enough to kill the (non-evil) necromancer who is trying to help them, then they could continue the adventure by reading her journal.

Not that I would want to continue DMing the adventure for such a moronic group of players.
 

Ancalagon

Dusty Dragon
I've heard good things about Paizo's efforts. People seem to have high praise for Rise of the Runelords for example. But I've not run them.

But I'd also say that just because everyone is probably doing a poor job, doesn't mean WotC could be doing a better job :) - they are the 800lb gorilla in the RPG space after all.

I guess I don't understand why the state of the art hasn't gotten better after all these years. At least I don't understand why obviously useful information for DMs is not included (like encounter difficulty expectations etc - which I believe is an aspect of Paizo's offerings?).
at the risk of sounding like a broken record, the Alexandrian has written about this. The tl,dr is that important unwritten rules/advice for DMs were well, not written down and knowledge was lost with time.


This can lead to terrible adventure structures.
 



Eltab

Hero
Writing down to much detail is a recipe for a railroad.
It is a recipe for a division-point yard: 1001 tracks going every which way and many important services available but it is not clear how to get where you want to be or in what order things might best be done.

If anybody ever tries to follow my notes and collected 3e materials for my Tiamat campaign ... if their head does not explode, only Indiana Jones will be able to locate and rescue them.
 


tolcreator

Explorer
I'm planning on combining the characters of Velynne and Dannika Greysteel into a character called... Dannika Greysteel. Who I'll make a divination wizard and who does lots of scrying in their spare time. That way when then show up out of the blue with 3 dog sleds, or finds out where the McGuffin is and why we need it, they'll have divined it or scryed it etc.
 

Halloween Horror For 5E

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