Shouldn't Prestige Classes be done differently?

[BiggusGeekus]

I do, however, like the idea of some kind of shared benefit that's quantifiable in game rules.

You can use the feat system for this.....

Eric's Fanboy
Description: You are a fan of Eric.
Benefit: You have a +2 circumstance bonus to your Diplomacy and Gather Information checks because everyone likes Eric.
Prerequisite: You must belong to the Guild of Fanboys and purchase a secret decoder ring for 5gp.

Envoy of Eric
Description: You have advanced in the Guild of Fanboys and can speak on behalf of them.
Benefit: You gain a +2 bonus to your Bluff and Intimidate bonuses, because no one messes with the Fanboys, yo. Also, if 10th level or higher, you gain a snazzy ride. The ride is valued at 20,000gp, has a base move of 100', can carry two people, is cherry red in color and has Eric's 3e logo as the hood ornament.
Prerequisite: Must have the Eric's Fanboy feat

Noah-anic Minion
Description: You now have advanced in the Guild of Fanboys to an almost sublime point. You even got to meet Eric once and have his signature that you framed.
Benefit: You can shoot laser beams out of your eyes. This is a spell-like ability that you can use three times per day. It has a range of 60', requires a Reflex DC 18 to save for half damage and does 3d20 points of damage (one d20 for each edition). Also, you are now type undead.
Prerequisite: 15th level. Must have the Envoy of Eric and Eric's Fanboy feat.

 

[Mark Causey]

To go along more with what Eric and BiggusGeekus are talking about, and maybe as an answer to the original poster, Unearthed Arcana also has a solution, IMO.

Change the name Bloodlines to Guild or Guild Training (something like this also appears in FFG's Midnight CS). Choose abilities appropriate to the bloodline guide listed in that section, and put in only the things that the guild would teach or focus on in your game.

If you join the guild, and always work with them and focus all of your time and training with them, then you can use the "Major Bloodline" to show how their training, over the levels, is bringing you toward their standard. Being less focused on that guild can be shown in the lesser bloodlines. Then, every few levels or so, you can 'give up' a level to represent the training you need to do, or however you want it represented in your game. More specifically, for each time that you've given up a level in this way is an easy way to demarcate social levels. You've given up three levels in you guild/bloodline? You could be a high-ranking member now. Want a cool feat to be awarded at certain levels of the guild? These blank levels would be the time to hand them out; you certainly don't get them at any other time. Want it to be a test based organization? Make the test equal the amount of experience points necessary to move through that level, with a long term extensive goal at the end that would need the things that you've picked up along the bloodline/guild along the way. Your character could already pass the second level test? Let him start just after the second level given up in the bloodline/guild. What you get from all this is players choosing whatever classes they want, getting some in-game benefits to training with a guild, and a nice framework/structure for some more of the social aspects of it.

*whew*

There's my two cents.

 

[Andor]

If you really need a book example of how an organization need not be limited to a single prestige class, then note that in the Complete adventurers they have two organizations each of which have two associated prestige classes depending on the characters focus within the guild.

Daggerspell guardians > Daggerspell mage / Daggespell shaper

Order of Illumination > Shadowbane Inquisitor / Shadowbane Stalker

Who is to say that in your campaign the Guild of Feathered Death doesn't include Arcane Archers, Order of the Bow intiates, Deepwoods Snipers, and plain old Scouts, Rangers and Fighters?

-Andor

 

[BiggusGeekus]

Change the name Bloodlines to Guild or Guild Training (something like this also appears in FFG's Midnight CS). Choose abilities appropriate to the bloodline guide listed in that section, and put in only the things that the guild would teach or focus on in your game.

This is a really good idea. A kick-butt alternative if you ask me.

 

[Crothian]

This is a really good idea. A kick-butt alternative if you ask me.

Ya, that is a realyl good idea. That is some great thinking outside the box!!!

 

[MoogleEmpMog]

I try to avoid associating PrCs with organizations in any way. Feats (or bloodlines, for something a bit different) are an interesting idea, though.

Absolutely any class is, at its core, a set of game mechanics that represent what you want a character to do. The assassin class certainly represents an efficient package of abilities for many, if not most, assassins - but not the only such package.

A druid, as usual, would probably make the best assassin: mouse in, flame strike the target (or maul him in treant form), sparrow out. Quick, efficient and almost completely untraceable, not to mention absolutely terrifying. A single-classed wizard, warlock or rogue also makes for a capable stealth killer. A bard can do it in a pinch, ala Dark Sun. Monks are nasty assassins because they're effectively always armed. In terms of PrCs, an invisible blade sometimes makes a better assassin than an assassin.

An effective assassin's guild will consider all of its operatives assassins, but as few as 15% would probably have the PrC in a typical campaign. The vast majority would be lower level rogues, rogue/fighters or wizard/rogues. The actual assassin-class characters would be elite, although not necessarily as elite as, say, the rogue/swashbuckler/invisible blade/ninja of the cresent moon who is acclaimed as the world's greatest hired killer, or the wizard/shadow adept who is the guild's magical specialist.

All of these characters are "assassins" to those around them, and they probably think of themselves as such. Little do they know that their character sheets disagree...

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

I usually run into this argument in a slightly different form - "Why can't Good characters be assassins?"

People will look at the Assassin Prestige Class, notice that it has a requirement of "Any Evil," and assume, therefore, that all assassins are Evil. They'll then construct more or less elaborate stories of Good characters who believe in targeting the Evil heads of armies and kingdoms rather than the more or less innocent rank and file, etc. This, they say, is proof that any character should be able to take levels in the Assassin Prestige Class.

As I explain it, the problem they have encountered is the difference between a "Big-A" Assassin and a "Little-a" assassin.*

To whit, a little-a assassin is nothing more than someone who has assassinated someone (or something!) else, whether it was a one-time occurence ("You killed the King of Dysia?") or more of a career choice ("While I draw breath, no Priest of Calwru shall rest easy.").

A Big-A Assassin, on the other hand, is a particular kind of assassin. Specifically, those who are members of a stereotypical fantasy Assassin's Guild, where they are taught the rudiments of dark magic in service to a darker cause. They are members of the type of organization where it is almost as dangerous to be on the list of clients as it is on the list of targets.

The Assassin Prestige Class, as written, is a Big-A Assassin.

This should not prevent people from creating characters who are little-a assassins - they'll just need a different PrC.

*Similarly, the difference between Big-B Barbarians (berzerk fighters) and little-b barbarians (tribesmen).

 

[Crothian]

I usually run into this argument in a slightly different form - "Why can't Good characters be assassins?"

There is a LG Assassin prestige class in the BoED

 

[TheAuldGrump]

Actually, that's pretty much my complaint entirely. Prestige classes seem to force an organization into a pretty limited scope.

Only if you let it.

It never even occurred to me that anyone would think that all members in a guild have the same class. (The bulk of the Assassins Guild in my campaign are warriors and rogues, just hired muscle. Only the elite are the Assassin class, and not even all of them. It is sort of a fiddles and violins thing I think.)

The Auld Grump

 

[jerichothebard]

And if you think about it, there are quite a few prestige classes that work well together anyway:

Sacred Exorcist and Hunter of the Dead and Consecrated Harriers
Loremasters and Contemplatives
Duelist and Dread Pirate
Shadow Dancers and Arcane Tricksters

(In fact, several of the above examples are drawn from my campaign)



Alternately, there exists the possibility of a prestige class being taught by multiple organizations. Duelists is a popular one, and nicely sets up the scenario of rival schools getting into duels of honor all over town.

Plus, a school of swordsman wouldn't just teach the elite fighters - IMC, they take in the wealthy sons of the aristocracy, and grossly overcharge them to teach them the rudiments of swordplay...

and so on and so forth...