Sneak attack w/ Blinding Barrage?

[LittleFuzzy]

I know another guy who plays a ranger, and always declares before rolling his Twin Strike that "the green d20 is my quarry attack", even after being told dozens of times that he can just stick the quarry on whichever one hits...

Better that than trying to do it when the attacks are being directed at two different targets.

 

[lukelightning]

Every time I see blinding barrage I want to say "Ze goggles! Ze do nothink!"

 

[Destil]

Blinding barrage is awesome for a rogue. Good against swarms (both the creature type and masses of minions), solos and even tough non-solo single targets.

Believe me, the party will thank you when everyone's on their last legs and you hand out a -5 to hit to half your opponents.

 

[Sunglare]

This was something i was going over with with a fellow GM today and the problem we see is that Close attacks specifically state that damage is rolled once and before you roll to hit.
So if you had a rogue who is invisible and use this blast on 4 guys, he has combat advantage against all of them. He rolls his damage first including his sneak attack damage and then procedes to roll his attacks and applies that damage to those he hits.
It's only 1 damage roll so it's only being applied once. This is another way of looking at it as I see it.

 

[corwyn77]

This was something i was going over with with a fellow GM today and the problem we see is that Close attacks specifically state that damage is rolled once and before you roll to hit.
So if you had a rogue who is invisible and use this blast on 4 guys, he has combat advantage against all of them. He rolls his damage first including his sneak attack damage and then procedes to roll his attacks and applies that damage to those he hits.
It's only 1 damage roll so it's only being applied once. This is another way of looking at it as I see it.

Consider that rogues don't need to choose to use SA until after damage is rolled. So you roll damage for BB, roll all the attack rolls, then decide which target, if any gets the SA damage.

This also means that you can wait to see which ones die initially so you aren't wasting SA on a minion. Warlocks work this way as well. Rangers apply their damage after the attack, not damage, presumably because they normally can only have one quarry. Kinda screws Battlefield Archers though.

 

[Sunglare]

Yeah, after reading the errata over and over again it does only apply to one target in the blast but I don't see it as unbalanced if a GM was to allow it 1 damage roll per turn. plus the cool factor if a rogue can catch all targets in the blast off guard.
It's still not as nasty as a wizards Freezing cloud which would be 1d8+INT mod x2 because when the monster goes again he is going to suck up the damage again.

 

[Lord Sessadore]

Yeah, after reading the errata over and over again it does only apply to one target in the blast but I don't see it as unbalanced if a GM was to allow it 1 damage roll per turn. plus the cool factor if a rogue can catch all targets in the blast off guard.
It's still not as nasty as a wizards Freezing cloud which would be 1d8+INT mod x2 because when the monster goes again he is going to suck up the damage again.

Getting SA on all targets would be a little unbalancing. Consider the level 1 rogue with Backstabber, using shuriken. That is much, much nastier than the Wizard's freezing cloud. The cloud does (1d8+Int)*2, while BB will do 2d6+Dex+2d8 to each target. The wizard has to have about a +7 Int to stay even to the rogue's damage in this case. That said, Freezing Cloud is a ranged attack, so is a little more versatile in target selection than BB.

 

[ghearus]

Getting SA on all targets would be a little unbalancing. Consider the level 1 rogue with Backstabber, using shuriken.

Yes, it is unbalancing. Consider the epic Martial Power feat "Whirlwind Sneak Attack", which allows you to deal Sneak Attack to all targets of a power that you have combat advantage over. Applied to the Level 23 power Steel Entrapment, and with Backstabber it becomes Close Blast 5, 3[W] + 5d8 + Dex + immobilize target. Compared to say, the Level 27 Wizard Encounter Black Fire that is Close Blast 5 for 6d6 damage, this already seems a touch unbalanced, but wait! For just a few levels more we'll throw in a heaping load of cheese!

Mix with Epic Resurgence (regain encounter on critical) and Daggermaster (crit on 18-20), and Wraithblade (extra Sneak use on crit) for a sprinkling of cheese. Even better, coat the whole thing with cheese by mixing in Deadly Trickster's Trickster Control feature at level 24 (if you roll 18-20 on a power, the power is not expended), or use the Eternal Seeker's Seeking Destiny to get Trickster Control and then use the other features to really make things crazy.

 

[AkaKageWarrior]

Yes, it is unbalancing. Consider the epic Martial Power feat "Whirlwind Sneak Attack", which allows you to deal Sneak Attack to all targets of a power that you have combat advantage over. Applied to the Level 23 power Steel Entrapment, and with Backstabber it becomes Close Blast 5, 3[W] + 5d8 + Dex + immobilize target. Compared to say, the Level 27 Wizard Encounter Black Fire that is Close Blast 5 for 6d6 damage, this already seems a touch unbalanced, but wait! For just a few levels more we'll throw in a heaping load of cheese!

Mix with Epic Resurgence (regain encounter on critical) and Daggermaster (crit on 18-20), and Wraithblade (extra Sneak use on crit) for a sprinkling of cheese. Even better, coat the whole thing with cheese by mixing in Deadly Trickster's Trickster Control feature at level 24 (if you roll 18-20 on a power, the power is not expended), or use the Eternal Seeker's Seeking Destiny to get Trickster Control and then use the other features to really make things crazy.

I'd say whirlwind sneak attack is okay, because:
- it's epic
- usually only once per encounter:
-- when will you ever have combat advantage against so many opponents? - except for the first round?
- the rogue's a striker!

AKW

 

[Sunglare]

Getting SA on all targets would be a little unbalancing. Consider the level 1 rogue with Backstabber, using shuriken. That is much, much nastier than the Wizard's freezing cloud. The cloud does (1d8+Int)*2, while BB will do 2d6+Dex+2d8 to each target. The wizard has to have about a +7 Int to stay even to the rogue's damage in this case. That said, Freezing Cloud is a ranged attack, so is a little more versatile in target selection than BB.

Well lets not half-ass the damage potentional.
Rogue: 2d6(weapon) +5(dex) +2d8(sneak attack) x9 targets= 297

Wizard: (1d8+5)x3 (extended by orb) x25 targets = 975