Sneak Attacks

[Shadowbit]

I situation recently came up in my D&D game. My character is a rogue, and thus has the Sneak Attack ability. We were in a fight, and I was informed by the other players that when I made my attack, before the flat-footed manticores we were fighting, I would only be able to get my Sneak Attack bonus damage.

I was under the impression that a rogue (or anyone with Sneak Attack) got their bonus dice whenever an enemy who could be sneak attacked was denied their dex bonus, flanked, or what have you.

I had five attacks. Should I have received Sneak Attack damage on all five attacks since my opponent was flat footed? They claimed that as soon as my first attack hit, the manticore was aware of me and thus could no longer take the additional damage.

 

[DogBackward]

You are considered flat-footed until you take an action. After you attack the first time... nope, they still haven't taken an action, which means they are still flat-footed. It doesn't matter if they're aware of you or not, they're not actively defending themselves yet. You get sneak attack on all five (five!?) attacks.

 

[Shadowbit]

You are considered flat-footed until you take an action. After you attack the first time... nope, they still haven't taken an action, which means they are still flat-footed. It doesn't matter if they're aware of you or not, they're not actively defending themselves yet. You get sneak attack on all five (five!?) attacks.

I'm a level 17 rogue/swashbucker with Two Weapon Fighting and Improved Two Weapon Fighting. I get three attacks normally, plus an additional two attacks for the two weapon fighting feats.

More than likely, if the group actually lets me do sneak attack damage on a flatfooted target again, I will never have another opponent who isn't a construct or undead.

 

[Felix]

Sneak Attack is not Backstab. Sneak Attack dice are added when:

Target is denied Dex bonus.
Target is flanked.

This is subject to several conditions including:
Target is not immune to crits.
Target does not have concealment.
Target's vital spots can be reached.

Nowhere in there does it say, "until the target becomes aware of the rogue".

----

May I ask how long you've been playing 3.5e? And how familiar the other players are with 2e?

 

[RigaMortus2]

I situation recently came up in my D&D game. My character is a rogue, and thus has the Sneak Attack ability. We were in a fight, and I was informed by the other players that when I made my attack, before the flat-footed manticores we were fighting, I would only be able to get my Sneak Attack bonus damage.

I was under the impression that a rogue (or anyone with Sneak Attack) got their bonus dice whenever an enemy who could be sneak attacked was denied their dex bonus, flanked, or what have you.

I had five attacks. Should I have received Sneak Attack damage on all five attacks since my opponent was flat footed? They claimed that as soon as my first attack hit, the manticore was aware of me and thus could no longer take the additional damage.

Did you start the combat right next to the flat-footed manticores? Because if not, you would have to take a Move Action to move up to them, and then you could only make 1 attack, which would have Sneak Attack damage.

 

[Dross]

I think the only case knowing the rogue is there that makes a difference RE sneak attacks is this situation:

If you are invisible and you attack, only the first attack gets sneak attacks, any subsequent attacks don't have sneak attack damage added. (someone will correct me if I'm wrong )

In the case cited the manticores haven't acted/are flat footed. ALL attacks add sneak attack damage until the manticores' go (even if they decide just to stand there).

It seems that the SA Damge only on the 1st attack is a semi-common house rule, or that it is getting confused with precision damage on a volley (which only occurs on the fist hit)

 

[Felix]

It seems that the SA Damge only on the 1st attack is a semi-common house rule

Because we saw dozens of threads asking this same question all the time back when 3e was released, I'm more inclined to suspect that it's a holdover from 2e or some other similarly-ruled system.

or that it is getting confused with precision damage on a volley (which only occurs on the fist hit)

If a target is flat-footed and a Rogue attacks three times with Rapid Shot, the precision-based Sneak Attack damage is added every time. Or perhaps you were talking about Manyshot?

 

[Darklone]

I think the only case knowing the rogue is there that makes a difference RE sneak attacks is this situation:

If you are invisible and you attack, only the first attack gets sneak attacks, any subsequent attacks don't have sneak attack damage added. (someone will correct me if I'm wrong

That's right. Note that this does not help flat-footed manticores, you still will sneak attack them 5 times.

It seems that the SA Damge only on the 1st attack is a semi-common house rule, or that it is getting confused with precision damage on a volley (which only occurs on the fist hit)

It seems to be so common that many people think it's corerules and the question is asked since years about once per month... or more often.

Edit: Felix was fasta about Manyshot. Get Greater Manyshot. And no, it's not a psions only feat!!

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

More than likely, if the group actually lets me do sneak attack damage on a flatfooted target again, I will never have another opponent who isn't a construct or undead.

Heh.

Sneak attack is so easy to negate it's almost trivial. Aside from creature type negation, you can also equip for it (+1 heavy fortification armor), and if you have concealment, you don't take sneak attack damage.

Also, if you're not sneak attacking, your damage drops into the toilet, since you're unlikely to have much Strength or much Power Attack to throw in, and you're not packing damage-add feats like Weapon Specialization.

And heaven help you if the target you unload on lives through it, and they turn around and return the full attack favor.

Brad

 

[stonegod]

Heh.

Sneak attack is so easy to negate it's almost trivial. Aside from creature type negation, you can also equip for it (+1 heavy fortification armor), and if you have concealment, you don't take sneak attack damage.

Yup. This is why blur or displacement are such great rogue protection.