D&D 5E So, 5e OGL

[delericho]

Paizo built up a good enough reputation to convince about 2/3rds of the Dragon/Dungeon subscribers to support further 3.5 material in the face of an imminent 4E launch.

Yep. I'm pretty sure that it was the end of the magazines, rather than the OGL, that is the key factor in the rise of Pathfinder. That forced Paizo to do something, while at the same time giving them an inbuilt audience of ~40k former subscribers who were inclined to support a company that had a very good reputation for quality at that time. The OGL made Pathfinder in its current form possible, but even without it Paizo would have had to come up with something or fold the company.

I no longer buy Paizo stuff and have not since 2012 but in 2007 I was mad at WoTC for killing of Dragon and Dungeon.

A lot of people were. The irony being that WotC actually acted pretty well, IMO - they actually allowed Paizo a few-month extension of their contract to let them finish out the "Savage Tide" Adventure Path before pulling the mags, something they were under no obligation to do.

 

[Morrus]

The reality is if 4E was that good people would have flocked to it. .

Now that's not how the world works, I promise you!

 

[Morrus]

But that's a big rabbit hole to be going down for something that won't ever happen. If WotC wanted rid of Pathfinder, there's a far easier, cheaper, and more certain way to do so: buy Paizo.

Paizo's a privately owned company. What makes you think they want to sell?

 

[delericho]

Paizo's a privately owned company. What makes you think they want to sell?

Everything has a price. If WotC offered a cheque with enough zeroes on it, a deal would be done.

I don't think WotC would go down that route, and indeed for the same reason I don't think they'd go to court to try to end the OGL - I don't think they're particularly concerned about Pathfinder anyway. But if they were absolutely determined that Pathfinder must go, then the really big cheque is the way I'd expect them to choose - as I said, it's easier and more certain. I can't be certain about it being cheaper, right enough, but that seems likely given that they'd be fighting to end a license that was specifically designed to be permanent.

 

[Kramodlog]

Plus they would be buying talent, subscribers and a solid e-store/distributor.

But how much is Paizo worth? The RPG industry is worth 15 million $ according to ICv2.

 

[delericho]

But how much is Paizo worth? The RPG industry is worth 15 million $ according to ICv2.

Isn't that an estimate of the annual turnover, though, rather than the value of the company itself? Paizo also has significant accumulated value in IP, in the form of Golarion, all those adventures, the Pathfinder Tales, and so forth.

Though either way, my answer is the same: no idea.

 

[Morrus]

Everything has a price.

That's very cynical. I'm not sure that's true. And even if it were, the price it's worth to WotC isn't necessarily the price it's worth to Lisa Stevens, etc. which renders it effectively "not for sale".

For example, I can't imagine selling EN World. Not because I don't have a price, but because it isn't worth as much to a third party as it is to me. If I sold it, I have to think about what I'm going to do instead for the rest of my life. Not that anybody would buy it anyway, but it serves as an example.

 

[Kramodlog]

Smoke cigars on beaches while conting your billions?

 

[Kramodlog]

Isn't that an estimate of the annual turnover, though, rather than the value of the company itself? Paizo also has significant accumulated value in IP, in the form of Golarion, all those adventures, the Pathfinder Tales, and so forth.

Though either way, my answer is the same: no idea.

You have no idea? How has that stop anyone from stating their opinions on the internet!?

 

[delericho]

That's very cynical. I'm not sure that's true.

Unfortunately, the older I get the more convinced I become that I'm laughably naive.

It's not literally true that anything is for sale. I don't actually believe in absolute rules - almost all of us have some red lines that we absolutely wouldn't cross... and even then, that 'absolutely' probably isn't absolute. People are just awkward like that.

And even if it were, the price it's worth to WotC isn't necessarily the price it's worth to Lisa Stevens, etc. which renders it effectively "not for sale".

This is true. Again, it would only be an issue if WotC were convinced that they had to do something about the OGL (which, in effect, means Paizo - nobody else is really big enough to be an issue, and nobody else is in a position to replicate what they did). So it does become a balance between how much WotC really care versus how much it takes to overcome Paizo's "not for sale".