Kaodi
Legend
What campaign was that in? I have been reading Sagiro's Story Hour pretty much since it began, and I do not remember any mention of a lasher, or anything of the sort, in that one.
D&D 5E Something I would not like to see in 5e: The Tempest
- Thread starter Andor
- Start date
What campaign was that in? I have been reading Sagiro's Story Hour pretty much since it began, and I do not remember any mention of a lasher, or anything of the sort, in that one.
Savage Wombat
Hero
Isn't the real problem that "Tempest" is a stupid name for a two-fisted fighter?
FireLance
Legend
The problem is, D&D is in part inspired by source fiction that has characters who wield seemingly ineffective weapons and fighting styles and still manage to do well and look good. 3e's answer to the conflicting needs of emulating both reality and the source fiction was to peg normal effectiveness closer to (what the designers felt was) reality, and to require characters who wanted to use these (supposably) sub-optimal weapons and fighting styles and be on par with characters who took more traditional approaches to spend character customization options such as feats and levels in prestige classes. The extent to which they succeeded, balance-wise, is another matter of course.
To me, it's an issue of what you are prepared to give up: emulation of reality, emulation of fiction, or simplicity (in the sense that fiddly character customization options don't exist).
To me, it's an issue of what you are prepared to give up: emulation of reality, emulation of fiction, or simplicity (in the sense that fiddly character customization options don't exist).
Piratecat
Sesquipedalian
Sagiro doesn't discuss game labels much, but you know Dranko's whip? At this point in the story hour Dranko is a cleric 5 / rogue 7 / lasher 6.
Kaodi
Legend
Aw, shucks. I guess I was not witty enough to make what I was saying clear in the last post. I will give it another go though: Dranko who?
Piratecat
Sesquipedalian
The noise you hear is me smacking my head. Repeatedly. It's been a long day!Aw, shucks. I guess I was not witty enough to make what I was saying clear in the last post. I will give it another go though: Dranko who?
You DO know that I can give negative XP, right? Right?
Savage Wombat
Hero
Wait, the admins are level-draining undead?
Kaodi
Legend
Well, since I am not a cat like you, I think I only get three lives (or strikes). With this I think I have used up two on the same joke, so I guess it is probably time to call it quits on that one,
.But you know that the joke is only so tempting to make because you and Sagiro, as revealed by your StoryHours, are like two of the main ingredients in the D&D Cookbook recipe for Pure Awesome, right?
Andor
First Post
Dranko rocks!
Although oddly enough I don't have a problem with the lasher PrC despite the point of this thread....
Why is that?
Well, because the whip isn't really a weapon. It's a tool which can also inflict damage.
And when I think about the Lasher PrC I mostly remember "Third Hand". Which came what, 3 levels into a 10 level class? The rest of the class however is still not about somehow using a whip to lop dragons in half, it provides themantically appropriate abilites which are more about status infliction and control than raw damage. A lasher is never going to stand toe-to-toe with a raging barbarian in a DPS contest. And that's okay.
Suppose you had a "Shoveler" PrC.... If all it did was somehow try to turn something as stupid a Spetznaz throwing shovel into an awesome weapon of mass destruction, I would hate the class. If it somehow made a shovel seem more shovelish and yet also useful I suppose I would be okay with it, although it sounds like a dandy 3 level class, I don't see how you could get 5 out of it. And I would never be crazy about it.
And besides, as much as I love me some mystery men, a Shoveler is simply not high level heroism.
Man this thread is going in spirals....
Ok. Here is my position.
Single item centered prestige classes which do not represent a fictional or mythic archetype are bad. Single item centered PrCs that perform a useful mix of roles are good. Single item centered PrCs that desctribe a role or fighting style which is historically, mythically or ficitonally justifiable are somewhat acceptable, but I'd much rather see it done within the scope of the fighter class.
However for the most part I would must rather see item/weapon speciallization and skill building handled through the feat and/or powers maneuver system.
Arcane Archer is good. A non-magical archer PrC might also be acceptable, but I'd rather see it covered by the baseline figher/ranger. The Lasher is a cool PrC, but it could be done instead with a simple feat chain (Weapon focus whip, 3rd hand.)
A gladiator is not a varient or subclass of the fighter, it's a fighter. A retarius, secutor and murmillo are not sub-classes of gladiators, they are fighters. An archer, a lancer, a flamberge wielder, a lajatang wielder, a dragoon, a samurai, a skirmisher a landsknecht, a man fighting case or florentine. These are all fighting men, who make their living by trade in arms. They are fighters. Why would they need another class?
Although oddly enough I don't have a problem with the lasher PrC despite the point of this thread....
Why is that?
Well, because the whip isn't really a weapon. It's a tool which can also inflict damage.
And when I think about the Lasher PrC I mostly remember "Third Hand". Which came what, 3 levels into a 10 level class? The rest of the class however is still not about somehow using a whip to lop dragons in half, it provides themantically appropriate abilites which are more about status infliction and control than raw damage. A lasher is never going to stand toe-to-toe with a raging barbarian in a DPS contest. And that's okay.
Suppose you had a "Shoveler" PrC.... If all it did was somehow try to turn something as stupid a Spetznaz throwing shovel into an awesome weapon of mass destruction, I would hate the class. If it somehow made a shovel seem more shovelish and yet also useful I suppose I would be okay with it, although it sounds like a dandy 3 level class, I don't see how you could get 5 out of it. And I would never be crazy about it.
And besides, as much as I love me some mystery men, a Shoveler is simply not high level heroism.
Man this thread is going in spirals....
Ok. Here is my position.
Single item centered prestige classes which do not represent a fictional or mythic archetype are bad. Single item centered PrCs that perform a useful mix of roles are good. Single item centered PrCs that desctribe a role or fighting style which is historically, mythically or ficitonally justifiable are somewhat acceptable, but I'd much rather see it done within the scope of the fighter class.
However for the most part I would must rather see item/weapon speciallization and skill building handled through the feat and/or powers maneuver system.
Arcane Archer is good. A non-magical archer PrC might also be acceptable, but I'd rather see it covered by the baseline figher/ranger. The Lasher is a cool PrC, but it could be done instead with a simple feat chain (Weapon focus whip, 3rd hand.)
A gladiator is not a varient or subclass of the fighter, it's a fighter. A retarius, secutor and murmillo are not sub-classes of gladiators, they are fighters. An archer, a lancer, a flamberge wielder, a lajatang wielder, a dragoon, a samurai, a skirmisher a landsknecht, a man fighting case or florentine. These are all fighting men, who make their living by trade in arms. They are fighters. Why would they need another class?
Dice4Hire
First Post
I actually liked the prestige classes for sub-optimal builds, even though none of them really make the build optimal. They were good flavor and rewarded a player who went with a more flavorful option.
I would like to see weapon talent trees for a lot of weapons, or single trees that apply to all weapons. Sure swords are better, yadda yadda yadda, but having a variety of weapons is more fun.
I would like to see weapon talent trees for a lot of weapons, or single trees that apply to all weapons. Sure swords are better, yadda yadda yadda, but having a variety of weapons is more fun.
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