Special Conversion Thread: Finishing off giants and their kin

[Big Mac]

No 3.X giants have stats for their juveniles, despite this being a very common thing to do in previous edition. So that's a vote for no.

If other giants drop them, then it is best to copy that.

If we really want to give them an extra bonus for using clubs, we can give them Weapon Spec as a bonus feat. But I don't want to--I think this comes to difference between editions. We neither need nor should want to literally convert every mechanic on display here.

I think we need to look at the mechanics and see which are important to the creature and which are more about the edition it came from. But if people think this is something that can be cut, I'll go along with that.

It still might be nice to mention their homemade weapon construction in the blurb. It would be a good way for these creatures to rearm themselves (over time).

Ditto for the huge muscles and long legs--giants are already strong and are faster than people.

How about something similar, like a pass without trace or move silently bonus?

The swamp water spittle does seem like a ranged touch attack, and I like the idea that they need a full round to gulp up new water. We might want to increase the acid damage, due to their CR. Also, I think changing dazing to blinding (in the eyes!) or stunning (due to the force of the blow).

Blinding in the eyes works best for me.

A +6 natural armor bonus works, especially if we assume they're also wearing some form of armor. I like the Hide bonus.

Armor sounds nice. I think that homemade armor construction might be a useful thing to put into these guys.

I don't think bosk giants should have a Charisma bonus. They may be handsome, but they're also coarse, rude slavers.

Fair enough.

Speaking of, I agree that they should have humanoids included in their organization as slaves, but having them choose humans exclusively seems far too literalist for my taste.

I think the "human slave" thing, is probably more tied into the humans of Chislev being one of the least well prepared targets. Outside of Spelljammer, it would make sense for bosk giants to enslave whoever was easiest to catch.

 

[Shade]

Newsflash: ENWorld moderator finishes off trolls.

Film at eleven.

Added to Homebrews with some of the basics. I'll dig further into the discussion to fill in the blanks.

On the subject of the extra damage for the greatclubs, I get the impression that they basically are converting the weapon from just bludgeoning to bludgeoning and piercing damage, like a morningstar. The old-school method was simply to add a few extra points of damage to note such a difference.

I may have missed it, but I didn't get the impression they wore armor. +6 natural is a bit low...similarly-sized cloud giants have +12. +8 natural would preserve their converted AC of 16.

 

[freyar]

Hmm, it says they usually don't wear much, so I have to agree with Shade on the natural armor (though you put +6 natural in the homebrews).

Do we want to find a crude bludegeoning and piercing weapon or just stick with the greatclub?

Hide bonus in bogs, marshes, swamps, etc, +8?

 

[demiurge1138]

We could give them a Gargantuan morningstar, ala cloud giants.

 

[Big Mac]

More SJR7 blurb on Giants

I've copied this stuff from SJR7 as I think it might help with the conversion process:

The dominant species on the planet are giants. Hill giants live in the mountains south of the equator, and swamp and bosk giants live throughtout the globe. These latter two giants are detailed in the Monstrous Compendium entries at the end of the suppliment.

All giants have the rudiments of civilisation, living in crude villages with simple forms of government. The rulers of these villages are usually the strongest, with leadership frequently determined by combat. Giants disdain both the humans and demihumans on Chislev, considering them little more than animals. The swamp giants have left the humans and demi-humans alone, and have fought them only on the rare occasions when the "small ones" have ventured onto giant land. However, bosk ggiants have no qualms about attacking and capturing humans. No humans or demi-humans have been known to survive combat with these giants.

 

[Big Mac]

On armor:

Hmm, it says they usually don't wear much, so I have to agree with Shade on the natural armor (though you put +6 natural in the homebrews).

I concur with this. They have thick skin and don't wear much.

On weapons:

Do we want to find a crude bludegeoning and piercing weapon or just stick with the greatclub?

...and...

We could give them a Gargantuan morningstar, ala cloud giants.

Could we not do both? Most Bosk Giants could have great clubs, but the most intellegent ones could "whittle" themselves the uber-morningstar. A GM could then put down 5 Bosk Giants and give the leader a spikey club and the rest the blunt clubs.

On hide bonuses:

Hide bonus in bogs, marshes, swamps, etc, +8?

You need to put jungle in the list because Chislev is a global jungle where the only variety is the type of tree in the various forests.

Page 43 of SJR7 Krynnspace says: "Chislev is a jungle. From pole to pole this world is covered with plants. Chislev has no oceans and only a few dozen lakes. Most of the water on this world is choked with vegitation".

On Bosk Giant slavery:

Here is a useful quote from page 45 of SJR7:

Humans and demi-humans are rare on Chislev, with most living on the northen and southern poles away from large perdatory animals. These bands of humans, elves, dwarves and kender are loosly-knit and disorganised. They are primative, barbaric, and move about to find food. Only a few of the bands have established communities, and these are without any form of government. The focus of these tribes' lives is to stay alive. Strength, the ability to gather food, and top hunting skills are most admired.

The humans (taken as slaves) and demi-humans mostly live at the cooler poles of Chislev. They are all uneducated barbarians, and all of the giant races think of them as little more than animals. That isn't necessarily going to apply to other gameworlds, so I think you are right to swap the races that Bosk Giants target.

I think that if a GM is going to put these creatures on another game world, they should stick them in a swamp or wet jungle and have them raid all nomadic races in the area.

On bosk giant society:

Village leaders need to be good fighters, and I'd love to see most of the leaders get the Gargantuan morningstar that demiurge brought up.

All Chislev giants look down on smaller races, but the bosk giants seem to especially think of themselves as the "master race". I think that bosk giants should use their slaves the way that a shepherd would use a dog to heard sheep or a tracker would use a dog to follow a scent trail. Mind you, I'm not entirely sure what role a slave can take in a crude village, especially one that is built in swamps. Maybe they tend to the stagnant pools of water that the bosk giants like to drink from. Slaves could dig holes that fill up with stale water.

 

[Shade]

So...Gargantuan greatclubs for the non-leaders, Gargantuan morningstars for the leaders (note that they do less damage with more versatile damage types)?

 

[Big Mac]

So...Gargantuan greatclubs for the non-leaders, Gargantuan morningstars for the leaders (note that they do less damage with more versatile damage types)?

Less damage, huh?

Would it be dodgy to make them mastercrafted gargantuan morningstars?

 

[Shade]

No, but masterwork only provides a bonus to attack rolls, not damage.

If we want them to do more damage, I'd recommend making a two-handed version of the morningstar to compete with the greatclub. Probably 1d10/x2 bludgeoning and piercing damage.

 

[Big Mac]

No, but masterwork only provides a bonus to attack rolls, not damage.

If we want them to do more damage, I'd recommend making a two-handed version of the morningstar to compete with the greatclub. Probably 1d10/x2 bludgeoning and piercing damage.

The "whittled" version was originally supposed to be an "improvement", so I think that if the 3rd edition replacement is carved from a slightly bigger branch it would fit in with the spirit of the original weapon.

(I think this also means that community leaders should be both extra intellegent and extra strong.)