Special Conversion Thread: Lycanthropes and their ilk

[Cleon]

I think I'd start with the basic stats from the Werepanther thrall and increase.

So what increases do you fancy? We'll want a fair boost to Wisdom and Charisma for a start.

Agreed with the special abilities. With the SLAs, I guess we need to figure out which ones are vampire ones...

Kharkov's got the usual forget and charm powers of Nosferatu vampires, but IIRC those are (Su) abilities rather than (Sp).

 

[freyar]

Hmm. Bump to Wis 17, Cha 18?

 

[Cleon]

Hmm. Bump to Wis 17, Cha 18?

Let's see, some apposite creatures are:

Werepanther Thrall: Str 21, Dex 19, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 11, Cha 8
Jagwere: Str 21, Dex 18, Con 17, Int 11, Wis 12, Cha 6
Werejaguar: Str 21, Dex 19, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 11, Cha 8
Werejaguar Witchdoctor & Jaguar Priest: Str 20, Dex 18, Con 17, Int 14, Wis 18, Cha 8

I'd like the Wisdom to be at least as high as the Charisma, since the Panther Lord is a divine spellcaster. Maybe make them both 18?

The 2E Werepanther is "Very" Intelligent (11-12), the next bracket up from "Average", so I'd like the Panther Lord to have an Intelligence bonus of at least +1.

How about Str 21, Dex 18, Con 17, Int 13, Wis 18, Cha 18?

That's the physical stats of our Jagwere conversion, two of which (Dex & Con) match the Jaguar Priest. That seems appropriate.

 

[freyar]

Sure, that'll work for me. What part do you want to sort out next?

 

[Cleon]

Sure, that'll work for me.

Updating Panther Lord Working Draft.

What part do you want to sort out next?

I guess we should settle which of its other stats ought to be the same as the Werepanther's hybrid form.

I reckon we're OK with:

Speed: 30 ft. (6 squares)
Armor Class: (+3 natural)
Treasure: Standard

It's worth noting that its Fortitude save of +5 is a LOT worse than the Werepanther Thrall's +9.

Do we want to do something about that?

 

[freyar]

Speed, NA, treasure seem fine, though I wouldn't mind bumping treasure to double since it is a "lord" after all.

Hrmmmph. Is that due to the animal saves?

 

[Cleon]

Speed, NA, treasure seem fine, though I wouldn't mind bumping treasure to double since it is a "lord" after all.

Well how much treasure would you expect them to collect living in a mud hut in the middle of nowhere?

The original Werepanther has Treasure Type (C), which is nothing special.

Hmm, come to think of it I don't remember AD&D Jackalweres being very wealthy, so what treasure did they have in AD&D? Let's see, they had...

...Type C! same as the Werepanther.

I guess they made some good investments during the edition-change to 3E.

In that case we might as well give the Panther Lord double standard too.

Hrmmmph. Is that due to the animal saves?

Well the Thrall has saves from two sets of HD, Animal and Warrior, which both have good Fort saves. The Panther Lord only has one set of HD - Monstrous Humanoid with its poor Fort saves.

Shall we do anything about it?

 

[freyar]

Yeah, the stock market really went up in the '90s!

It really isn't a very good Fort save. If nothing else, we should make sure it gets Great Fort, but I could see giving that as a bonus feat, maybe. Or bumping Con a bit.

 

[Cleon]

Yeah, the stock market really went up in the '90s!

Maybe they make a killing in Jungle Hut Futures?

Updating Panther Lord Working Draft.

It really isn't a very good Fort save. If nothing else, we should make sure it gets Great Fort, but I could see giving that as a bonus feat, maybe. Or bumping Con a bit.

I'd rather just fiddle a bit and give them all good saves. Either make them "Dire" or change it to a Native Outsider.

Of those two, Dire sounds better to me.

The Fort save difference with the Thrall is +4, so giving them Great Fortitude for another +2 would only bridge the gap halfway. The other alternative of increasing the Con by 8 points seems a bit too much!

I guess we could use a combination - i.e. Great Fort plus +4 Con - but good Fort saves seems a neater solution, since it changing the +2 base Fort to +6 to deliver the 4 point increase we need.

 

[freyar]

Dire is a bit weird for a monstrous humanoid --- do we have any precedent for that?