Spiked Chain: The Ultimate Defenders Wep or Sir Not Appearing in the Edition?

[kennew142]

Ditto, and my player does as well. He likes the look of the SC. And, as a previous poster said, the only way he can really hold his own with the wiz and codzilla. Hopefully 4E will fix that, and his SC user will still be viable

I'm shopping this idea around to the other GMs in my group as we speak. If this isn't the rule in our upcoming 4e campaigns, we may house rule it.

 

[HeinorNY]

The spiked chain could be a normal weapon and don't have reach anymore. It only threatens 5ft. squares around the wielder, but as an immediate action the wielder could apply 'reach' to his attack only.

With a feat or talent the character could be allowed to use an immediate action to threaten all 5ft. and 10ft. squares around him for 1 round, as a defensive stance. The character rotates the spiked chain like crazy around him.

I think it could be better as "the character could be allowed to use an immediate action move action to threaten all 5ft. and 10ft. squares around him for 1 round, as a defensive stance. The character moves into the fray and rotates his SC like crazy.

As an immediate action the character could choose one square that's 10ft. away from him and consider it threatened for 1 round or whenever someone provokes AoO from that square.
The caster shift back to cast a spell and the SC character gives him a spiked surprise.

 

[kennew142]

I think it could be better as "the character could be allowed to use an immediate action move action to threaten all 5ft. and 10ft. squares around him for 1 round, as a defensive stance. The character moves into the fray and rotates his SC like crazy.

As an immediate action the character could choose one square that's 10ft. away from him and consider it threatened for 1 round or whenever someone provokes AoO from that square.
The caster shift back to cast a spell and the SC character gives him a spiked surprise.

I liked the original better. We're starting to get into more complex and situational rule now.

 

[hong]

I reckon half the heat would go out of the spiked chain debate if they just used a more credible picture than the one in the 3E PHB; ie, spikes at the ends, not along the whole length.

 

[CleverNickName]

I reckon half the heat would go out of the spiked chain debate if they just used a more credible picture than the one in the 3E PHB; ie, spikes at the ends, not along the whole length.

Or, they could just replace it with any one of a dozen pictures of Gogo Yumari and that awesome chain in Kill Bill Vol. I

But of course, that is a meteor hammer, and not a spiked chain...but I doubt any many of us would complain.

 

[Imp]

The problem is the "threaten at a distance". If the chain worked like a whip, where you can make attacks farther out, but it does not increase your threatened area, it would be much saner.

This is how I houseruled it in 3.5. Oh and I took out the spikes. Basically, it is a meteor hammer in my setting. (The spikes went on a different chain weapon, essentially a morningstar-on-a-chain that didn't have reach but did bashing/piercing plus finessable plus you could sling it a real good distance, javelin-range.)

I am also kinda laughing at the notion of the spiked chain being deployed on the battlefield, and rank upon rank of hopelessly tangled-up soldiers.

 

[HeinorNY]

I'm shopping this idea around to the other GMs in my group as we speak. If this isn't the rule in our upcoming 4e campaigns, we may house rule it.

If you turn it into a feat or class ability, don't forget to name it in 4E style

Cobra Spike Bite
Iron Tentacles Assault
Steel Fang Dance
Death Chain Tornado

 

[FireLance]

The real problem is the combination of increased size, reach and improved trip. IMO the real culprit is the improved trip feat. It gives a +4 on trip checks and a free attack on a downed opponent. Since trip checks do not include BAB (a serious flaw IMO), low level characters have little trouble tripping even high level opponents. Combine this with the free attack, the AoO when the tripee goes to stand and the penalties involved in being prone and you have a feat that is entirely too good.

If ability checks are also modified by half level, that would mitigate the problem of low level characters tripping high level characters in 4e.

 

[Lord Zardoz]

I reckon half the heat would go out of the spiked chain debate if they just used a more credible picture than the one in the 3E PHB; ie, spikes at the ends, not along the whole length.

As I mentioned in a different thread, this weapon is the victim of two different problems.

Myself and CleverNickName are mostly bothered by the mechanical implementation. It could have been described as an entirely different weapon (some form of polearm, a non spiked chain, etc), and it would still bother us. As CleverNickName mentioned, it is the only reach weapon that can also threaten an adjacent foe, it is finesse-able, you can trip with it, and you get a disarm bonus with it. It just does too many things too well compared to other exotic weapons.

Other people are just bothered by the verismimilitude of the weapon. People look at the picture, read the description, and wonder just how the hell someone could use it without inflicting serious injury on themselves.

I think that if they only had half of the chain or just a striking tip spiked, and scrapped the trip and disarm bonus, I would be ok with it as a reach weapon also able to threaten nearby spaces.

END COMMUNICATION

 

[hong]

As I mentioned in a different thread, this weapon is the victim of two different problems.

Yeah, that's why I said half the heat.