Stargate: Atlantis 07/16/2004 (Untagged Spoilers)

Chimera said:
That's my only real problem with the premise. They didn't take near enough;

A: Food
B: Ammunition
C: Daily Supplies (toothpaste, toiletpaper, fresh underwear, etc)
D: Tools and spare parts

I'd have been driving semi loads of this stuff through the gate. Heck, if you don't want to waste time showing that, at least show the Atlantis gate room filled to the brim with boxes and bins... "Ok people, find a place to put all this stuff!"

Otherwise, I kinda like the Wraith. Creepy cannibalistic bad guys can't be all bad.

I liked the Amanda Tapping line on the show about the new series. Something like "Powerful enough to have destroyed the Ancients, stupid enough so that humans can beat them week after week."

That Amanda Tapping line was terrific and instantly endeared the series to me. One thing I've always liked about SG is that they never took themselves too seriously.

re: Ancients vs Wraith - The ancients apparently never faced a real threat to themselves until they found the Wraith, IIRC. So they probably would have not been terribly milliterized. Think of the US vs some place like North Korea or the old Soviet Union. The US has practically no internal controls on movement or military security vs any sort of uprising/attack internally. Where as in a totalitarian state it's almost impossible to travel without permision and certainly not in large numbers.

Military conflicts from what I have read are generally won by the side that is the least incompetent. Competent leaders with a professional military are a very rare thing in history and generally result in conquring large chunks of the globe. A society that is essentially unfamiliar with large scale military conflict would be likely to screw up quite a bit and thus loose even though they might be a nominally superior force.

In the American Civil war the North had virtually every advantage, far greater industrialization, substantially larger populations and the technological edge. However it took Lincon like 3 years to find a general who could find his ass with both hands and to get the military into a functioning state. The South essentially got all of the trained military leaders and had a much more of a warrior mentality. I suspect in part at least due to the threat of slave revolts. So they repeatedly kicked the Union all over the battlefield for the first couple of years.

Another thing about the wraith is that there was essentially only a night watch on "duty" that the SG:A people encountered and they were only expecting to be facing hunter gatherers. So it probably wasn't their "A-Team". What the rest of them are going to be like is a better question, but their numbers may still be limited by their "food" supply. Since they wouldn't go into hibernation unless there was some compelling reason.

They are probably not some sort of the Ancients as one person mentioned, since the holographic message specifically stated that the wraith were "awakened" which indicates that they had been there for some time previously before the ancients encountered them.

Finally, in the end it could just be that like the Gou'aud, the wraiths simply arent that good at waging war, but they were savage enough and better enough at it than the ancients to defeat them, but aren't not-incompetent enough to beat a species that has had LOTS of practice at war and has gotten really good at it (ie. Humans).
 

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One thing I found interesting is how the Ancients 'awakened' the Wraith and
now, millions of years later we did the same. Which makes you think, outside
of the Wraith, the Pegasus galaxy seemed a pretty life-less place. Perhaps,
the Wraith had simply finished 'eating' the entire galaxy and then, out of food
and with no means of finding more, had gone into hibernation. I mean, to exist
pre-ancient they must have had something to eat.

Until the ancients found them and awakened them. Now, not wanting to do
make the same mistake twice, the Wraith herd the post-ancients like cattle but
through time, we're simply not efficient enough when it comes to breeding and
there aren't enough humans to go around for everyone. So they go back into
hibernation until such a time that we've grown enough in numbers that there's
enough food output for everyone.

Of course, then we come and offer an alternate solution. A door to another galaxy
full of life.
 

Wycen said:
Didn't they invent some new chemical substance that kept them alive without the symbiotes? Or maybe it just suppressed them.
Actually, that was so that Jaffa who had been hosts to Goa'uld could survive without them.
 

Kesh said:
Actually, that was so that Jaffa who had been hosts to Goa'uld could survive without them.

Nope, it is so Jaffa could survive without their symbiotes. Goauld do not take Jaffa hosts. It might be physically impossible.
 

Kahuna Burger said:
I didn't find the Wraiths too Go'aould like myself, and I think they'll be an ok villain. I wouldn't worry too much about humans fighting the destroyers of the Ancients either - they have been top species for a very long time and could be easily expected to grow complacent and have much of their fighting prowress (as opposed to terrorising and harvesting prowress) atrophy. We see it enough with "good" races, why not a baddy?

I agree with KB. I see the Wraiths as psionic vampires, with inbred powers, rather then Gaould based who use technology on the most part.
 

DM_Matt said:
Nope, it is so Jaffa could survive without their symbiotes. Goauld do not take Jaffa hosts. It might be physically impossible.
Er... that's what I said? :) I meant, Jaffa who had been pouch-hosts, not head-hosts.
 

Kesh said:
Er... that's what I said? :) I meant, Jaffa who had been pouch-hosts, not head-hosts.

the jaffa physiology (along with other things) has changed over the run of the show. In the ep introducing Ryac, it was pretty clear that you got your snake in the belly at puberty (or not) and after that you were a jaffa and dependant on it. (at that time it was also implied that only guys got the snake) This was backed up by the Hathor ep where Jack almost got Jaffa-ed. But the backstory evolved over time to the idea that T'ealc's entire race had been changed over generations to the point where they were all had to get a snake by puberty or else (and all women needed snakes too). This meant that jaffa was not just a job/change to some, but the entire race. iirc, this was canon-ised with the amazon babe rebel jaffa ep.

So if we assume that the most current thinking is correct then all jaffa (race) have to have either a snake or the drug by their nature. But prior seasons have quotable evidence that jaffa (job) are created with their first implantation and would be normal humans otherwise.

Kahuna Burger
 

Kahuna Burger said:
So if we assume that the most current thinking is correct then all jaffa (race) have to have either a snake or the drug by their nature. But prior seasons have quotable evidence that jaffa (job) are created with their first implantation and would be normal humans otherwise.
However, it's an assumption that the Jaffa are Humans, since they've never really said one way or the other in the show conclusively.

It's entirely possible that Hathor just used whatever technique was used to engineer the Jaffa pouches on O'Neill to modify his genetic code... one of the fortes of the Goa'uld is genetic manipulation. We've seen it on numerous occassions, by numerous Goa'uld. However, since it wasn't Jack's original DNA, the sarcophagus restored him to normal... whereas with Teal'c, his race was engineered to have the pouch, and thus the sarcophagus can't heal him.

So in short, it could still go one way or the other.
 


LightPhoenix said:
However, it's an assumption that the Jaffa are Humans, since they've never really said one way or the other in the show conclusively.

I'm not certain, but in t'ealc's first apearance, wasn't he the one who introduced the word Tauri for the mythical first humans, who were the forbearers of all humans including jaffa?

Jaffa may be very different, but then, Jonas's people were geneticly different enough for Nerti to take a serious interest, and they've shown other "races" of humans that underwent enough evolutionary pressure to make some big differences. I count the jaffa in the same sort of catagory as altered humans, and I don't see any reason to think that they have diverged far enough to be considered a new species. But thats as much a general impression over the course of the series as any specific line I can conjure up in my head.

kahuna burger
 

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