Super Simple Weapons

[Satyrn]

Would the 1d4 weapon not have the light property then?

(Totally support throwing short swords! LOL)

EDIT: Throwing any weapon results in 1d4 as per the rules, so it is meaningful to have a 1d6 thrown weapon.

I'm actually suggesting that you drop the idea of a 1d4 weapon completely.

And that those with simple weapon proficiency can only use that one row on your chart reading "Simple Weapon" . . . which means no throwing weapons without martial training. (You'd probably want to hand out Light weapons to rogues)

 

[Satyrn]

So, this is the revision I'm suggesting:

[table="width: 650"]
[tr]
[td]Name[/td]
[td]Damage[/td]
[td]Properties[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Simple weapon[/td]
[td]1d6[/td]
[td]Versatile (1d8)[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Light weapon[/td]
[td]1d6[/td]
[td]Finesse, light, thrown (range 20/60)[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Martial weapon[/td]
[td]1d8[/td]
[td]Versatile (1d10)[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Great weapon[/td]
[td]1d12[/td]
[td]Heavy, two-handed[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Reach weapon[/td]
[td]1d10[/td]
[td]Heavy, reach, two-handed[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]​

And as I edited that, I crossed finesse off the Simple weapon, too. I'm leaning towards the idea that "if you don't have martial training, you have 1 - one! - option because, really, you're not using weapons anyway."

 

[mrpopstar]

I'm actually suggesting that you drop the idea of a 1d4 weapon completely.

And that those with simple weapon proficiency can only use that one row on your chart reading "Simple Weapon" . . . which means no throwing weapons without martial training. (You'd probably want to hand out Light weapons to rogues)

Ah!

So, this is the revision I'm suggesting:

[table="width: 650"]
[tr]
[td]Name[/td]
[td]Damage[/td]
[td]Properties[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Simple weapon[/td]
[td]1d6[/td]
[td]Versatile (1d8)[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Light weapon[/td]
[td]1d6[/td]
[td]Finesse, light, thrown (range 20/60)[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Martial weapon[/td]
[td]1d8[/td]
[td]Versatile (1d10)[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Great weapon[/td]
[td]1d12[/td]
[td]Heavy, two-handed[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Reach weapon[/td]
[td]1d10[/td]
[td]Heavy, reach, two-handed[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]​

And as I edited that, I crossed finesse off the Simple weapon, too. I'm leaning towards the idea that "if you don't have martial training, you have 1 - one! - option because, really, you're not using weapons anyway."

Oh!

YES. I can get behind this.

 

[Laurefindel]

Would the 1d4 weapon not have the light property then?

(Totally support throwing short swords! LOL)

EDIT: Throwing any weapon results in 1d4 as per the rules, so it is meaningful to have a 1d6 thrown weapon.

In trying to abstract the weapon table to its quintessential nature, some granularity will be lost (i.e. a handaxe that should be thrown but not finessed vs a shortsword that should be finessed but not thrown). Personally, i think it's all right.

Personally, i'm cool with shortsword being thrown. While perhaps not realistic, it's cinematic enough to keep IMHO (they do it in the movies all the time). Spartan hoplite throwing its shortsword in the face of it's enemy? That's bad-ass. DEX-based elven axe thrower? I'm cool with that too. Dual-wielding 1d6 rapier swashbuckler? Why not.

For what it's worth, I think your (super) simple weapon table is fine just the way it is [edit] it was in your last post.

 

[mrpopstar]

[table="width: 650"]
[tr]
[td]Name[/td]
[td]Damage[/td]
[td]Properties[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Simple weapon[/td]
[td]1d6[/td]
[td]Versatile (1d8)[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Light weapon[/td]
[td]1d6[/td]
[td]Finesse, light, thrown (range 20/60)[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Martial weapon[/td]
[td]1d8[/td]
[td]Versatile (1d10)[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Great weapon[/td]
[td]1d12[/td]
[td]Heavy, two-handed[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Reach weapon[/td]
[td]1d10[/td]
[td]Heavy, reach, two-handed[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[tr]
[td] - Loaded weapon[/td]
[td]1d6[/td]
[td]Ammunition (range 30/120), loading[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td] - Ranged weapon[/td]
[td]1d8[/td]
[td]Ammunition (range 150/600), two-handed[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]​

About as simple as it can get.

 

[mrpopstar]

In trying to abstract the weapon table to its quintessential nature, some granularity will be lost (i.e. a handaxe that should be thrown but not finessed vs a shortsword that should be finessed but not thrown). Personally, i think it's all right.

Personally, i'm cool with shortsword being thrown. While perhaps not realistic, it's cinematic enough to keep IMHO (they do it in the movies all the time). Spartan hoplite throwing its shortsword in the face of it's enemy? That's bad-ass. DEX-based elven axe thrower? I'm cool with that too. Dual-wielding 1d6 rapier swashbuckler? Why not.

For what it's worth, I think your (super) simple weapon table is fine just the way it is.

Thank you! I haven't updated the OP with the continued push for hyper simplicity because I think it best represents super simple in terms of the RAW.

 

[Yaarel]

Simple d6 light/versatile, finesse, thrown
Martial d8 versatile
Great d10 heavy, two-handed, reach

Note, the simple weapon is either light (can use off-hand, like shortsword) or versatile (can use two-hand, like staff).

 

[Laurefindel]

[TABLE="width: 650"]
[TR]
[TD]Name[/TD]
[TD]Damage[/TD]
[TD]Properties[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD] - Simple weapon[/TD]
[TD]1d6[/TD]
[TD]Versatile (1d8)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD] - Light weapon[/TD]
[TD]1d6[/TD]
[TD]Finesse, light, thrown (range 20/60)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD] - Martial weapon[/TD]
[TD]1d8[/TD]
[TD]Versatile (1d10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD] - Great weapon[/TD]
[TD]1d12[/TD]
[TD]Heavy, two-handed[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD] - Reach weapon[/TD]
[TD]1d10[/TD]
[TD]Heavy, reach, two-handed[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD] - Loaded weapon[/TD]
[TD]1d6[/TD]
[TD]Ammunition (range 30/120), loading[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD] - Ranged weapon[/TD]
[TD]1d8[/TD]
[TD]Ammunition (range 150/600), two-handed[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
​

About as simple as it can get.

I like that (although I still miss that 1d10 2-handed loading crossbow, the "great weapon" equivalent to ranged weapons).

If I may add to the simplicity, keep to two range bands; a short/thrown range and a bow/crossbow range. I'd suggest 30/60 and 60/240. Nice round numbers matching the average speed that a creature can cover in one round of 6 seconds. I you want something closer to RAW, use 20/60 and 80/320 or 100/400.

 

[mrpopstar]

Simple d6 light/versatile, finesse, thrown
Martial d8 versatile
Great d10 heavy, two-handed, reach

Note, the simple weapon is either light (can use off-hand, like shortsword) or versatile (can use two-hand, like staff).

I was toying with this same thing!



(Without the divide between light and versatile. Easiest for 1d6 to represent a broad range of useful application at the “simple” level. Nothing breaks.)

I like that (although I still miss that 1d10 2-handed loading crossbow, the "great weapon" equivalent to ranged weapons).

If I may add to the simplicity, keep to two range bands; a short/thrown range and a bow/crossbow range. I'd suggest 30/60 and 60/240. Nice round numbers matching the average speed that a creature can cover in one round of 6 seconds. I you want something closer to RAW, use 20/60 and 80/320 or 100/400.

I do like the idea of only two (thrown and ammunition) range bands.

 

[Yaarel]

Simple ammunition d6 light, shoot 30 feet
Martial ammunition d8 two-hand, ammunition, shoot 300 feet
Great ammunition d10 heavy, two-hand, loading, shoot 300 feet



Here are the ranged weapons from the Players Handbook

Simple ammunition d6 light, shoot 30 feet
• handbow
• sling

Martial ammunition d8 two-hand, ammunition, shoot 300 feet
• longbow
• shortbow
• crossbow, light

Great ammunition d10 heavy, two-hand, loading, shoot 300 feet
• crossbow, heavy
• [greatbow]

Nondamage weapons
• blowgun (poison delivery)
• net (restrain)

Note, difference in ranges between simple ammunition shoot 30 feet versus martial ammunition shoot 300 feet. The simple is light, usable in the off-hand. The loading has been removed from the light crossbow, characterizing the setup to load a bolt as about the same as an arrow for a bow. Conversely, the greatbow (the huge Japanese one!) would require more setup to load the arrow, as does the heavy crossbow with its mechanical gears for drawing the string.

In reallife, the shortbow is as good as a longbow, and requires as much skill. The term ‘shortbow’ means the composite bow, where the main difference between a shortbow and a longbow is the compact size of the shortbow that allows shooting from horseback, but its composite materials are more easily damaged and require more maintenance if applicable.



Simple d6 light/versatile, finesse, throw 30 feet
• dagger
• dart*
• hammer, light
• handaxe
• javelin
• spear
• trident

* Note, dart (a hand-thrown arrow) is here a throw weapon, like dagger, shuriken, throwstick, boomerang, javelin, etcetera.