switching a versatile weapon between 1h and 2h, what action?

Drakhar · Sep 18, 2008

I'd rule it a free action useable once per round, so a SM can switch from 1h to 2h for extra damage but loses the two AC from their warding until their next round when they can switch back if they wish to.

Thordain · Oct 20, 2008

Bumping from the grave..

I just called WotC about this. In my game my player is playing a swordmage and wants to switch to 2h as a free action, attack, then switch back to 1h. WotC said that this is within the rules, although it's up to me if I want to disallow it. I think asked if it's within the intent of the rules or if it's a loophole. He said "it's not the intent and it's not NOT the intent. It's not a loophole either, it's a creative use of the rules". So I will allow it in my game. Also if a monster has an interrupt attack then I will rule that the swordmage is using 2h at that time and will not get the +3 to AC

the8bitdeity · Oct 20, 2008

Thordain said:
Bumping from the grave..

I just called WotC about this. In my game my player is playing a swordmage and wants to switch to 2h as a free action, attack, then switch back to 1h. WotC said that this is within the rules, although it's up to me if I want to disallow it. I think asked if it's within the intent of the rules or if it's a loophole. He said "it's not the intent and it's not NOT the intent. It's not a loophole either, it's a creative use of the rules". So I will allow it in my game. Also if a monster has an interrupt attack then I will rule that the swordmage is using 2h at that time and will not get the +3 to AC

With WotC's ruling my current mindset is that a player can freely change as a free action, as many times as they want, but I'm ruling that the Free Action is not Immediate Interrupt "speed". If I say I'm attacking you and you didn't switch back to 1H (before I even mentioned I'm attacking you), you're only getting the +1 AC. After the attack you can switch, but it puts the responsibility on the player to maintain the state of their handedness.

elecgraystone · Oct 21, 2008

Check out question #20 in the FAQ. It's official, free action to change grips.
Answer

Tony Vargas · Oct 21, 2008

Since the Swordmage has come up, it seems like its class feature is meant to substitute for a shield to an extent. That is, that the swordmage, like a defending S&B fighter, should favor one-handed weapons. It's worth noting that a shield is considerably more trouble to ready or stow than a weapon or other item - presumably, that's to keep the S&B and THW types 'honest' by not rapidly switching between two-handed weapons for offense and shields for defense. If a class feature is meant to make characters of that class favor one-handed weapons, it should be similarly restricted in some way.

Perhaps the swordmage feature could be house-ruled to start with language along the lines of "If you have had a hand free since the start of your turn..." or end with something along the lines of "In order to use this power, you must keep one hand free throughout your turn."

Henry · Oct 21, 2008

It really hasn't made an issue in my 4e games to date (no swordmage), but I'm inclined for my games to say "free action, but you can only change grips once per round." That way, if you attack with one hand, you get the benefit to AC; if you attack with two hands, you get the benefit of the big old weapon, but also the penalty. At worst, a swordmage with a fullblade would get his extra shield bonus every other round.

elecgraystone · Oct 21, 2008

If you do that then drinking a potion or anything like that would make you use the lower defense. Seriously, it's only a +1 damage. I fail to see the big deal.

If someone interupts you when you attack they use the lower defense, if not they use the higher. Punishing a guy for needing to drink a potion seems extreme.

Zsig · Oct 21, 2008

Thordain said:
I think asked if it's within the intent of the rules or if it's a loophole. He said "it's not the intent and it's not NOT the intent. It's not a loophole either, it's a creative use of the rules".

I actually like that WotC response. And I have no problem with it. Cheese? There's lots of things worse than that in the game (I almost threw up the first time I saw Blinding Barrage).

Anyways, I'm running a game, and there's a Swordmage in the group, I had no trouble telling him he could do it, even though he didn't even know whether it was possible or not.

Lacyon · Oct 21, 2008

As always, the DM is free (and encouraged) to limit the number of times per round a free action can be used.

Seems like a non-issue to me.

Tony Vargas · Oct 21, 2008

elecgraystone said:
If someone interupts you when you attack they use the lower defense, if not they use the higher. Punishing a guy for needing to drink a potion seems extreme.

Ready is an immediate reaction, so immediate interrupts against that lower defense are going to be rare.

If you use a heavy shield you're 'punished' for needing to drink a potion - you have to sheath your weapon, take out the potion, drink it, and... oh, you're done, that's three minor actions: a full round to drink a potion, and you're unarmed until you can draw your weapon again. If you want to look silly, you can drop your weapon, pull out the potion, drink it, then pick your weapon back up - still takes all round. Wasting a standard action is arguably worse than having an AC bonus reduced.